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Thread: First ever 'issue' with the bike - would love some electrical help (lights fuse)

  1. #41
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    I have no idea what those videos are for. Every one of them is unrelated to your problem and off-topic.

    No, ignore the green wire. You only disconnected it to eliminate the solonoid and starter from the 'popping fuse' symptom. Which it did. Now you need to know if you need a solonoid (#21) or the whole thing.

    The schematic that Lunatic posted shows the starter wire (#23) that gets jumped to the battery terminal OR to the terminal on the solenoid (that's not shown on the diagram), but its the big terminal you see in the e-bay pics. Should take you about 3 whole seconds to do it.

    Replacing a starter is simple, but a PITA, and requires taking the primary cover off/fluid etc. The solenoid is much easier and cheaper. The test is quick, jump the big starter terminal (#23) to the big solonoid terminal you can see on top and if the solonoid (big square box mounted to the round starter). If the bike cranks over and doesn't pop the fuse, get a solonoid. If the fuse pops, doublecheck the big wires aren't grounded and then buy a starter.

    Thanks Lunatic! Where the heck do you find that interchange info, it's priceless!

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by lunaticfringe View Post
    no idea where this thread is headed but here's what you need to know:
    1-the entire starter assembly interchanges with 96-2005 chrysler mini-van starter assemblies. most are mitsubishi brand.
    2-you don't need to replace the entire assembly. dealer list is $369 last i checked. ebay ones typically 1/4th that price and chinese garbage units.
    2-the starter assembly consists of 3 components: the starter case and drive motor....the clutch drive hub....the solenoid.
    3-DO NOT run the starter motor with the primary cover removed as in the one vid posted on this thread.
    4-remove starter motor and simply replace the solenoid. this popped fuse you've been chasing? told you the simple test and you've performed same. that test shows a shorted solenoid. factory part # 31603-91 STARTER SOLENOID REPAIR KIT still over 7500 in dealer system last i checked. simply remove and replace. the solenoid activates the starter assembly. it is the big gizmo mounted atop the starter assembly and attach with 2 very long screws.
    5-an XB starter assembly virtually identical to H-D sporster repair and replace procedure and is very challenging for a novice. here's the schematic.
    Attachment 8760
    As usual - this is awesome and just what I need. Once I've tested the starter motor and (hopefully) narrowed this down to the solenoid, this is exactly what I'll do (the repair kit) - and I'll have someone more experienced do it for me.

    So - from a visual perspective - if I'm sitting on the right side of the bike - looking inward at the starter/solenoid assembly - the large terminal to the rear of the bike (my left) to which a larger wire loom is descending is the solenoid terminal, correct? From that perspective - where visually is #23...the starter terminal?

    Thanks in advance...
    Last edited by vicenzajay; 12-05-2017 at 03:07 PM.

  3. #43
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    So for double checking the big wires for an errant ground - talk me through how to do that. I can use a multi-meter (I've constructed numerous guitar pedals, instrument cables, and done simple continuity tests often enough) - just need the description of the procedure.

    My first guess (since we're talking about the positive battery cable feed to the starter, right?) is that I disconnect the battery cable - put the MM in ohms (not sure which scale) - one lead on the disconnected positive battery cable and one lead on a ground (tie bar ground wire?). The MM should show infinite resistance, right? If not, there's a short to ground in the wire?

    I can do this - just need to make sure I'm putting leads in the right place, etc.

  4. #44
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Lunatic: Thats funny! I can't say I'm surprised, there's no reason to re-engineer every single ancillary part of an engine. Gotta wonder about the seal issue though, the auto engine wouldn't need it. Have you tried it? That may be the issue with the wrong application of the rare-electrical part?

    V: The short wouldn't be in the battery cable or there would be a whole lot of smoke and fire. It could be in the very short wire (#23) that leads from the solonoid to the starter The starter lead is only energized when the starter is cranking (and right when the fuse blows). Ohm meter on the lowest setting, one lead grounded, the other on that (#23) end, hopefully the meter reads infinity, which means its ok. You could just stick your hand around and see if theres any corruption to the wire insulation too, the wire is about 3" long.

  5. #45
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    John and Shaughn...sure appreciate both of you guys being so detailed in sharing your knowledge. I hope to not have solenoid/starter issues...but I'll definitely be looking at this thread if I ever do!

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post

    Replacing a starter is simple, but a PITA, and requires taking the primary cover off/fluid etc. The solenoid is much easier and cheaper. The test is quick, jump the big starter terminal (#23) to the big solonoid terminal you can see on top and if the solonoid (big square box mounted to the round starter). If the bike cranks over and doesn't pop the fuse, get a solonoid. If the fuse pops, doublecheck the big wires aren't grounded and then buy a starter.
    Cooter,

    Is there a procedure to replace/repair solenoid WITHOUT removing the starter/primary cover/etc.? That would be a hugely important thing to know in my "way ahead" plan. It seems to be what you're implying in this post, but I'm not sure how that would go (if the starter and solenoid are one unit)?

  7. #47
    Senior Member lunaticfringe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by submax View Post
    John and Shaughn...sure appreciate both of you guys being so detailed in sharing your knowledge. I hope to not have solenoid/starter issues...but I'll definitely be looking at this thread if I ever do!
    anytime james and thanks for the very kind words. i have to finish up a bike build and a mach-III 500 restoration then tearing into that pitiful old Vincent. i'll do what you said and send you some pics along the way.

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    More to follow - but I got the bike down to Kevin today, and we troubleshot the problem. The culprit turned out to be something quite different than anything suggested or pointed to on this thread.

    For those 'non-mechanics' or novice troubleshooters (like me) that might look this thread up in the future - the offending circuit was the clutch safety assembly that plugs into the left gear housing. Kevin had spent some time on the phone with a couple of folks about my issues - Al (formerly of ASB) and another friend advised him (us) to check any 'safety' assemblies on the bike. Once we unplugged that two-wire plug on the left housing, the bike started right up (after re-inserting the signal wire). We were then able to reinsert the safety circuit plug and successfully duplicated the problem by promptly blowing the fuse.

    He's keeping the bike for a bit to do a couple of other things (O2 sensor replacement, etc.), but the solenoid and starter are in perfect shape. We're going to remove the safety circuit to take it out of any future contention (and I don't want it - probably the most important reason - didn't even know it existed).
    Last edited by vicenzajay; 12-08-2017 at 02:29 PM.

  9. #49
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    What the? How the heck?
    Not sure how that happened but really happy you are going again and can get some relaxation on the Buell. Now get it back and go ride

  10. #50
    Senior Member lunaticfringe's Avatar
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    "clutch safety assembly"......"left gear housing"? never heard of either.
    circled is alternator plug663027.jpg

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