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View Full Version : Idling difficulties (everybody seems to have some form of it)



Buell Kid
10-09-2012, 02:25 AM
Hey guys, new to the forum, been riding a Firebolt for about 2 years now (previously rode a Honda Bros 650, then a Honda VTR1000 (and a motley assortment of other various v-twins)). The Firebolt is def the most fun I have ever had on two wheels so far and the machine is so user serviceable.

Still, I am having some difficulties that I want to iron out, I love this bike (never felt this way before, etc) so I don't want to ditch her just yet.

Have been doing a bit of research and I would like to ask for some insight from some of the veterans here.

Usual story; '07 Firebolt xb12r @ 16,400k's with a plethora of intermittent idling problems.

Bike mods: (not much really) EBR ecm, Jardine slip-on can, K&N air filter.

Recent servicing at 15,000k's includes: Fresh Motul 7100 4T 20w50w oil, new HD plugs (at 10,000k's), Motul primary case oil, adjusted primary chain, new plug leads (at 10,000k's), new oil filter, TPS reset, yadda, yadda.

You will have to excuse my use of the metric system, we don't use miles here.

Bike history: Bought 2 years ago at 4,500k's (actually saved from a savage that was going to chop it up and make a stunt bike).

Symptoms include: recurring idle surging, rough idling, bogging down when opening up the throttle past 3/4 turn (especially noticeable traveling at 100kmp/hr or 60mp/hr @ 3000rpm), stalling when stopped, coughing, stuttering. All these symptoms seem to come and go as they please, I may have a few months of solid riding and she runs hard and fast then I will get the occasional attack of engine trouble which can last and few weeks and comes and goes intermittently during this period.

My symptoms seem to be the same as the problems this guy has:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkh1Ttms7jU

Pretty frustrating and embarrassing when it stalls and struggles (especially when my girlfriend is riding circles around me on her Kawasaki er6n and never misses a beat).

The one thing that I am yet to do is just replace the TPS outright.

The guy in the video link that I posted above had the same issues as myself, and most likely went through all the trouble-shooting, TPS resetting and heartbreak as I did before fixing his problems by fitting a new TPS.

I might as well try it, I have nothing else left to try at this stage, so I have ordered a new TPS and I will fit it this weekend.

Will I have to shag around with ecmspy and complete a TPS calibration before the running the bike for the first time or will it be okay to just fire her up and do a wheelie out the driveway?

I just blew my pocket money on the TPS itself so I don't have any dough left over for an ecm cable at the moment. Could just get the guys at the HD workshop to do it for me (pay 'em later) if I drop the bike off in my van, but they'll probably just try to sell me an xr1200x instead.

I also have the factory ECM handy; will I need to use this for the sake of trouble shooting? Will it be okay to fire it up with the factory ECM fitted with the K&N filter and Jardine on the bike?

Should I just set the bike on fire, bury it in the back yard and buy an 1125cr?

Any insight/tips/comments would be greatly appreciated before I crank her over with a fresh TPS fitted.

Kindest regards, cheers, etc.

Stillonit
10-09-2012, 02:36 AM
you should calibrate the tps....If you don;t get some idle problem god is smiling on you....

Stillonit
10-09-2012, 02:46 AM
somebody close to you with a cable should be able to help you out with a tps cal and reset. good luck
knowing me I would try to fire it up...and take a ride but don't think I would expect it to run perfect...:D

theMelvster6
10-09-2012, 03:17 AM
After replacing the TPS...which is a breeze to do. Hook it up to ecmspy and zero it and reset the TPS and AFV. Make sure the TPS reads 100% at WOT. I would suggest putting in some NGK Iridium plugs. ALSO...could be a good time to thoroughly clean out the throttle body. If you have not done a breather re-route, they tend to get a ton of oil build up in the intake. After you clean out the TB, at your next fill up of fuel run about 3-4oz (sorry don't know metric conversion) of Seafoam in the tank. It's a good fuel system cleaner. If you still have idle/running issues...try checking for an intake leak. They most often occur with failing intake seals. Hopefully this points you in the right direction.

Buell Kid
10-09-2012, 03:47 PM
Cheers Melvster, will pick up some NGK's and fuel system cleaner asap (love 'em).

I'll check the breather and TB tonight.

The seals around the airbox appear to be okay, there are no rips, tears or un-seated parts and the foam is clean.

Thanks kindly for the info, hopefully she'll have a strong pulse by saturday evening and ready for a few laps around the circuit for sunday.

theMelvster6
10-09-2012, 08:32 PM
I was talking about the rubber seals that are between the intake manifold and the intake port at the head...I had to change mine a few months ago. not terribly difficult, but time consuming.

http://store.jamesgaskets.com/images/products/26995-97-X.jpg

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/6369_20110701144459_L.jpg

If all else fails...that is where a lot of poor running conditions stem from. you can check it by letting the bike warm up and let it idle then spray the seat all the way around with carb cleaner or something. Hopefully this is not the case, but it is a last resort if previous steps do not fix it. Remember start with the easiest things and progress. More times than not, it is something really stupid.

07Bolt
10-09-2012, 10:39 PM
2007's had a recall/upgrade for the regulator. Factory upgraded in 2008. The regulator plug was succeptible to melting/arcing from high rpms. Changed from flat-pin style to round pin style. Reduced any chances of arcing. My 2007 xb9r did the same.

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/4617_20090914191935_L.jpg

jimijeans
10-13-2012, 11:12 PM
Replace your TPS Sensor first.Untill you get an ECM Data Cable you will need to depend on the dealer. IF you want to Try this , NOW it works sometimes and sometimes it does not. Make sure to plug the Velocity Stack with a clean rag so nothing goes down the intake while removing those bolts.
Make sure to back out the Idle screw first to make sure the Butterfly is closed all the way .Watch the small Bolts that hold the Throttle Position Sensor on the Throttle Body they are fragile after all the heat is intense in an air cooled Engine. After Removing all parts needed to get down under the Air box assembly When removing those Two Bolts the Blue sealant wil need to be cleaned off with some Cleaner to get the threads nice again.Take take your time. *Jimi