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lanretsr
05-16-2007, 10:27 PM
Hi, I just bought a xb12scg with about 1200 miles on it. I was going to change the oil just to be safe, even though it was supposedly changed at 1000 miles. What oil does everyone recommend running. I was going to use mobil 1 v twin, but I've also heard good things about klotz. Any recommendations? Also what is everyone using in their tranny? I just picked up some Formula + from harley, any good?

v12tiger
05-17-2007, 12:12 AM
I haven't put it in my bike yet but will probably go to royal purple next oil change.. Now thats some good stuff [up][up]

06xb9r
05-17-2007, 04:00 AM
Royal Purple is tha ****!

stevensue
05-18-2007, 10:52 AM
I just use Harley oil in Harleys, Honda oil in Hondas, and Kawasaki oil in Kawasakis. Maybe too simple, but it works for me.

I had a bad experience switching to synthetic oil once. Engine oil seal leaks on a Kawasaki with 40,000 miles on it. Replaced the seals and went back to Kawasaki oil.

Steve

2Evil4U
05-18-2007, 12:13 PM
I've used Amsoil 20W50 in both holes of my X since about 2k miles. I just turned 5k last night and no leaks or problems. I'm a dealer, so I use it in pretty much everything.

maybebuell
05-18-2007, 11:39 PM
koltz never herd of it..use any brand name 20/50 change 1000 to 1500 miles never have a problem...motorcycle oil car oil its all the same except for the price

USAbikesrule
05-18-2007, 11:49 PM
maybebuell - auto & bike oils are different, not just in price. Olive oil will work in a pinch, but it's not as good as Royal Purple. Klotz is an old race oil and is high in quality and lubricity. Oil is not oil ... don't be misled. Royal Purple rules on the dyno and Amsoil is real close. Synthetics rule over mineral oil. If I'm stranded, used cooking oil will suffice, but it won't protect for longevity.

lanretsr - change your oil frequently (3000) with filter. Use a quality synthetic and and fill the filter before installing it - 80%-85% of all engine wear occurs at initial start up, so don't run it with a dry filter. The bike will last you a long time. I know of an X1 with over 90K on the clock and never been apart. He follows the advice listed.

maybebuell
05-19-2007, 09:59 PM
two buddy have over 100.000 miles on a v twin im at 60.000..do some resurch.. they can not find any difference between the two..most test car oil protected better then so called bike oil......most syn oils make the harley v twins louder..as long as you change it it all works....

USAbikesrule
05-20-2007, 04:47 AM
maybebuell - Ignorance is a bliss.

maybebuell
05-20-2007, 03:38 PM
ya i can see that

USAbikesrule
05-20-2007, 04:38 PM
maybebuell - Maybe with an open mind and formal training you could swallow your pride and admit you're wrong. It's a real shame that with all the information available to us, you still possess that mindset. By your logic, olive oil is good for all applications if changed frequently. My statements are based on engineering FACTS, not opinions.

maybebuell
05-20-2007, 06:04 PM
how can you say then when are are articals upon articals about motorcycle oil vs car oil..not talking about syn just reg oil .......use of syn is great but im not one who will leave syn in my bike for 5000 miles...id rather use reg oil and change it 3 times......theres lots of guys i know including harley machanics who tryed syn and went back to reg oil...because of oil leaks and top end noise....if it worked for you thats great...im 50 years old owned well over 15 bikes...and seen more high milage bikes in my day....its not what you use its change it often bottom line....everyone i ride with have 113 ci motors and up..some have twice the tq of your buell and 50 more hp... and can run just as hot..... not getting into a pissing contest tryed it used it other people i know did the same.....its not my choice

USAbikesrule
05-20-2007, 06:53 PM
It's easy to say, because it's true. I'm older than you, been riding over 50 years, have had well over 100 bikes in my life, have a master's degree in the subject, and over 40 years in the industry working with factory race teams and dealing with service related issues and failure analysis - not to mention many years experience with oil analysis and dyno testing oils. I certainly can't explain in one simple message all you would need to know for a better understanding. Prove it for yourself - perform an oil analysis after the same period of time / miles with different oils and get the proof of the difference in wear. Oil anaylisis can be performed at quality race shops or your local aircraft service center. Measure horsepower at the rear wheel with different oils. Measure oil temperature after X period of time. Measure engine temperature with different oils. The FACT that the oil analysis proves MORE wear with mineral based oils and EVEN MORE wear with an automotive blend indicates a difference in wear. THE FACT that there is more rear wheel horsepower with a quality synthetic versus mineral based indicates a reduction in friction, therefore less wear. I have many years of engineering experience and proof to confirm the point. You are free to use what you want and believe as you will, but don't contaminate the real facts with your (or other's) opinion without proof.

On a real simple note - automotive engines run far cooler than air-cooled motorcycle engines, have far less horsepower per cubic inch, are subject to far less stress and strain, and at least another dozen differences I could list between the two.

USAbikesrule
05-20-2007, 07:08 PM
maybebuell - You mentioned 113 cu.in. engines - I currently only 24 motorcycles with 11 being Harleys and the biggest of those is an R&R 155 cu.in. street bike, not to mention the four "X" series Buells. An oil analysis will prove my point. I'll match the baby 113 inch engines with torque and horsepower before my bike ever comes on the cam. ... Just trying to help you out guy. The proof is on the dyno, engine temperature, and most importantly, the oil analysis. Top of the day to you sir.

maybebuell
05-21-2007, 01:18 AM
all sounds good guys enjoy the syn oil..i know reggie very well at R&R and ride with his son a few times a year..no syn in there personal rides eather....point was is there a difference in reg car oil to reg motorcycle oil.... syn car oil to syn motorcycle oil. ?....tell me the difference...dont tell me it has difference additives...what is the additive that makes it different between the two..the answer is none.. same additives in both oils.....tests all over the internet cant find a difference between the two except the price...I agree syn protects better...i dont agree that a motorcycle syn like mobil protects better then mobil syn car oil...the wear test that you talk about... temp test.. and dyno hp tests will show no difference between the two syn

maybebuell
05-21-2007, 02:13 AM
anyone from mass here....my 700 lb bagger is looking to race a buell...hey USA where you from post a pic of that 155 ci motor for all to see ...i pretty much think your a dreamer..prove me wrong post a pic.....

USAbikesrule
05-21-2007, 02:49 AM
maybebuell .. Just for you - go to www.rrcycles.com and look at the engine. Pics won't cut/paste without URL and my pics aren't on internet. No dreaming on this end, just reality. You're obviously a real sore loser as you're atypical of such - character assassination and denial rather than self admission of being wrong. Real pitty too.

jaredxb12
05-21-2007, 04:24 AM
i run syn-3 in my 05 xb12 and change it every 2500. seems to be doing me right. i think synthetic is the way to go. i belive alot of people have heard about synthetic causing oil leaks in bikes and this pushes them away. if you start with it early on your fine, its when you put it in higher milage bikes is when it may cause a leak around seals.synthetic has more cleaning detergent in the oil than standerd oil so when put in higher milage bikes it tends to clean all that goop the standerd oil has left behind from around seals and other parts causing leaks.hmmm... anyway, i use syn-3

maybebuell
05-21-2007, 08:11 PM
usa lol you go look at the motors on the web sight..I see then first hand...like i said a dreamer..your the one with the masters degree.....I asked a simple question...tell me the difference between the two oils. motorcycle oil.... car oil....your answer is... its motorcycle oil...ya ok allright..just stoped you right in your tracks usa.......you have no answer, no data

you cant even find data on the internet saying motyorcycle oil is better then car oil..it sayes the opposite.....

hey USA...the sign says ..( fine for hunting )..think the hunting is any good here

USAbikesrule
05-21-2007, 11:00 PM
maybebuell - I've already told you, maybe you can't read. The primary data collection and tests results show lower oil temperature, reduced engine temperature, lower HC emissions (as a result of lower oil temperature), and the real proof is in the oil analysis after each run. I have conducted this test on dozens of bikes over the years and the results are always the same. Premium synthetic motorcycle oils always have less wear than petroleum based oils. The proof is in the oil analysis - there is an increase in metal deposits with petroleum based oils. As I offered to you, change your oil at the same intervals and have an analysis performed and you'll see firsthand what I'm saying is true. Obviously, it is easier for you to spout off about something versus proving it right or wrong. I get paid to train groups on motorcycle dynamics, so why would I waste any time trying to convince you of something you probably wouldn't accept anyway? Prove it for yourself. You have bounced around on the subject and only want to argue. First, you said ANY oil is okay and synthetics only make engines noisier and leak. Then later you say that you know synthetics are better than petroleum but automotive is no different than motorcycle oil. I never offered to you a specific ingredient; I told you the tests results indicate motorcycle synthetic oils have higher lubricity properties than petroleum based oils. Another test you can do and prove a difference is the thermal breakdown point. Put the oils in a frying pan and increase the temperature. See which burns the easiest. Call a representative from BG or Royal Purple and ask them to give you a demonstration on film strength. You’ll see the difference.

It would be real easy to take your approach and attack you in the manner you have me – dreamer, etc. I could easily say you’re proof positive that there’s no cure for stupid or tell you to do your own “resurch” by starting with a dictionary. But I won’t. I have given you all you need to prove or disprove the idea by performing an oil analysis and see firsthand the results. Or, measure engine / oil temperatures – a reduction in temperature is certainly a reduction in friction, which equates to more available horsepower and longevity. Or, you can contact a BG or Royal Purple representative and let them show you the difference in film strength and protection.

As I said before, run what you want and believe what you will. If what you’re saying is correct, the race teams would have cases of Wal-Mart el cheapo oil in their hauler. I know all the articles out there and the comparisons, but few actually address the issue of longevity or debris / wear components of the oil analysis, let alone horsepower gains / losses or thermal differences. Ride safe.

maybebuell
05-22-2007, 02:25 AM
what dont you understand reread the post its not syn vs reg oil......its syn motorcycle oil vs syn car oil oil..reg motorcycle oil vs reg car oil whats the difference..is that hard to understand..thats what im saying they cant find any difference between the two...usually the car oil test the same or better then so called motorcycle oil........there are lots of harleys that the top end is louder with syn for some reason..thats a big reason why some go back to reg oil..for some reason syn will leak in areas on certian motors that reg oil wont ......those reasons alone is why people switch back to reg oil....there,s high milage motorcycles and cars on reg oil....people use what works for them......if you do end up using reg oil in a v twin change it often....i did not see lower temps on my motor with syn...only thing that droped oil temps was the addition of a oil cooler droped 40 deg....recap... motor top end louder and leaks or weeping with syn on certian motors....reg oil is not a problem its the best oil for my motor...my two other buddys with over 100.000 on there 113s it worked for them also....Usa you have a great day and enjoy your next ride...

Rifterzs
05-22-2007, 09:48 PM
wow, way to completely ruin the forums... what is the recommended weight? please get back on topic guys! what do you use?

slydwazer
05-22-2007, 10:08 PM
Wow is right! My life is simple. I use automotive oil in my autos and motorcycle oil in motorcycles. Syn-3 is good for all cavities, as well as Royal Purple Cycle Max - 20W50. Best advice is to pick one and stay with it. Changing from synthetic to mineral and back or brand to brand is not the best thing to do. I used Syn-3 in my Harleys and Buells until I switched to Royal Purple. Same oil in all cavities. Simple inventory!

Rifterzs
05-22-2007, 10:13 PM
good stuff, i'm really thinking about royal purple now that i've read this and another forum, i tried mobile 1 and don't like as much as syn3, but didn't like syn3 all that much either, i know purple is the best so if i'm not satisfied there tough, i'm just using it based on stats lol anyone got a suggestion on where to buy it for the best price?

Rifterzs
05-22-2007, 10:49 PM
ok which one do i get? regular 20/50, max cycle?

slydwazer
05-23-2007, 04:28 AM
Royal Purple Cycle Max 20W50 is the one. Good stuff!

mrdozer2you
05-23-2007, 02:27 PM
What do you mean when you say in "both holes"? There is only one place to put oil in, to my knowledge.

Rifterzs
05-23-2007, 02:55 PM
anyone tried 10x40? according to the royal purple site it says you can use it for buells, any reccomendation or the reasoning behind using 10w40?

slydwazer
05-23-2007, 03:13 PM
"Both holes" or "all cavities" means the engine oil and transmission - primary oil. You have an XB9, right? Engine oil change is drained from the swingarm oil tank and also filled there. The transmission-primary is drained on the bottom of the primary case and filled with the clutch inspection cover removed. 2.5 qts in the engine, ~1 qt. in the transmission-primary. Torque on the engine drain plug is 30 ft/lb and the primary is 11-15 ft/lb.

10W40 vs 20W50? For a cold climate area during the winter months, 10W40 would be okay. 20W50 is a little more viscous and handles the hot months better. I have lived in CA, AZ, GA, FL, & TX and use 20W50 year round. 10W40 is a little thinner, may have a little less "drag", but probably offers no real benefit in warmer climates. Hot areas really need the thicker stuff.

hottoddy69
05-23-2007, 07:58 PM
Ok,

I have to admit that the bickering is good drama. Quite honestly, I have learned a great deal from the exchange.............Thanks "USA" .

USAbikesrule
05-24-2007, 04:33 PM
hottoddy69 - You're welcome.

slydwazer - Good recommendation.

BuellPastor
07-20-2007, 10:43 PM
Royal Purple sounds great. What other maintenance do you guys do at home? USA - you are an incredible resourse. 24 bikes! way cool.

mrdozer2you
07-28-2007, 05:10 PM
Glad i re-read some old posts. Getting Royal Purple Cycle max 20w50 today. Couldnt remember the weight, checked old posts instead of making another new one.

pats self on back :D

rider1086
04-10-2009, 12:47 AM
Time for an oil change. Looks like royal purple seems to be the biggest choice. I have about 12,000 miles on my xb12r. What would be the correct procedure to do the oil change, what is the oil capacity and what filter do i need? Any input would be helpful.

Stevenc150
04-10-2009, 02:06 AM
- Top of the page, click "Buell Service Manuals" link. You'll find the procedure there.

- 2.5 qts. in Engine hole
- 1.0 qt. in Primary hole

- Oil Filter Numbers:

ACDelco # PF1233
Amsoil # SDF10
Bosch # 3311
Car Quest # 85394
Champion # C138
Fram # PH4967
HD # 63806-004
K&N # hp-1003, KN-177
Mighty # m4477
Napa # 1394
Mobil 1 # M1-103
Motorcraft # FL836
Penzoil # pz39
Purolator # L14476
STP # S4967
Valvoline # vo40
Wal-Mart Super Tech # ST4967
Wix # 51394

chase12s
04-11-2009, 11:28 PM
you have commenced the oil wars again. lol. I use Mobil-1 v twin in mine and i like it. Use Formula+ in the tranny.

rider1086
04-12-2009, 03:08 AM
thanks guys very helpful.:p[up]

marko138
04-13-2009, 01:30 AM
I use Amsoil Vtwin oil in both holes. Good stuff...engine is quieter, runs smoother, shifts easier, and runs cooler.

fahren
04-24-2009, 03:56 AM
I hate the complication of 2 weights and don't acutally use RP because I can't get it here, but the RP web site says to use 10W40 for Buell primary, and 20w50 in engine. There is such great drama in the oil war posts... but I think good synthetic, changed often - and changes depend also if you ride thru the winter or store the bike....

fahren
04-24-2009, 04:11 AM
oops - sorry - RP says 10W30 fr primary, not 40. so sorry...

chase12s
04-24-2009, 05:32 AM
I'm pretty tolerant but "maybebuell" you are a ****ing idiot. I've read over your posts and they're all dumb as ****. How about this, if you don't have a buell then **** off! Scientific studies don't lie synthetics perform better and last long than conventional motor oil. Pardon my french everybody else:)

stopie20
04-24-2009, 10:26 AM
Ok, first what I do know, you cant use an automotive oil in a motorcycle at all, unless you like replacing clutches. this is because there are friction modifiers in automotive oils that are not included in the oils "designed" to be used in your wet clutch aplications. And if you have ever ridden a motorcycle that has had automotive oil used in it you can feel that the clutch positive engaugement is very unpredictable and that can be dangerous... Actually an old motocross trick was to use automatic trans fluid in the tranny (if the tranny was seperate from the crank case) this makes the clutch grab like hell....

Now, what I dont know, I read the oil capacity numbers on the XB12s and that was 2.5qtsb but what i didnt find was any info on the primary capacity (except on here) after reading that you guys were running one qqt in your primary I added one qt to mine... well about 30 miles later I checked the oil level in the swing arm and the extra qt from the primary seemed to have migrated to the swingarm. I mean when I pulled the dipstick oil spued out of the top of the swing arm until I had about the full amount that I added on the ground. Whats up with that???

dave_xb12r
04-24-2009, 10:40 AM
I love the oil arguments. I run personal lubricants that are warm to the touch. Its get me excited while I ride. [up]

Edit: My friends girlfriend is a real gear head. He swears she uses 50w for her needs. Her brother is a friend of mine as well, he'll confirm because he's seen it in her room. *shudder*

chase12s
04-24-2009, 04:03 PM
I love the oil arguments. I run personal lubricants that are warm to the touch. Its get me excited while I ride.
:D:D:D

pittsleyb
04-24-2009, 05:54 PM
is burning a bit of oil on break in to 1000m normal? I have had to add 150ml to bring it back to normal range after changing it the first 500m. I can smell it burning off once in a while and just wanted to make sure this is normal?

also, i used mobile 1 vtwin in the main and have read i can use it in the primary as well. any advantages or disadvantages?

chuckanut
04-24-2009, 06:48 PM
Anybody use Castrol Vtwin?

HOVERJOCKI
04-25-2009, 04:38 PM
I've been reading here and going through the book and it says to use certain oils in the engine but it doesn't mention anything about what oil type to put in the primary.
I'm new to this maintainance stuff and so this will be my first oil change on anything.
NOW, can i put the same oil in the primary as in the engine or do i have to put specific primary oil that i have seen in the bike shops?
Not looking at starting or adding to a war on oils just trying to learn this stuff so i don't keep getting raped at that harley store.
Cheers

chuckanut
04-25-2009, 04:46 PM
I bought Lucas motorcycles oil and it said it was for Primary and Engine. We'll see how the stuff works. BTW, whats everybody paying for Mobile1 20-50? Almost bought it till I saw the price! $10.00 a qt?!

chase12s
04-25-2009, 06:13 PM
I been paying 8 bucks quart for the mobil1, at wal mart.

Stevenc150
04-26-2009, 03:53 AM
NOW, can i put the same oil in the primary as in the engine or do i have to put specific primary oil that i have seen in the bike shops?
It's all about personal preference though I believe in the protection that comes with running Full synthetic Motorcycle specific oil. LOTS of Buellers, including myself, use Full synthetic 20W50 cycle oil, in both primary and Engine with NO problems.

HOVERJOCKI
04-26-2009, 04:03 AM
Thanks alot guys.

stopie20
04-26-2009, 06:31 AM
only prob with syn is that your clutch wont work if you go back to blend or mineral

kajer
04-26-2009, 08:20 AM
I love the oil arguments. I run personal lubricants that are warm to the touch. Its get me excited while I ride.

Edit: My friends girlfriend is a real gear head. He swears she uses 50w for her needs. Her brother is a friend of mine as well, he'll confirm because he's seen it in her room. *shudder*

I know who you're talking about, and I asked him why 50w... apparently 75w-140 is too thick :p

architech
04-27-2009, 12:15 AM
Stopie, can you elaborate on that...??
As recommended by the parts desk, just switched to the HD Screamin Eagle Syn 20W50 (can get RP locally)

06buell
04-29-2009, 03:45 AM
I would like to switch to a synthetic oil in my buell but i can't decide what oil to get, alot of you are saying Royal Purple but i found a wear comparison chart claiming that royal purple is not as good as most other oils. It was also saying that Amsoil 20w-50 is the best for a V-twin. I am just wondering if people have been running amsoil or not and what makes everybody want royal purple?
Also does it matter what filter you use with different oils? and what filter is a good one for XB12ss?

stopie20
04-29-2009, 11:19 AM
Gladly, the performance of Your clutch plates is heavily dependant on the oil you run. The compounds found in full synthetic oils are 90% of the time not compatible with the compounds found in synthetic blend oils and never with mineral oils. So if you for any reason need to change oil in a pinch or add oil on the road and a full synthetic is not available you can add the mineral or synthetic blend, but you will end up with a permenant loss in clutch performance if not a complete loss of your clutch. Plus frequently these oils will gell or reject each other and that results in a cranckcase full of snot.

I always run a synthetic blend so I can return to mineral based with no problems...

Something else to think about when it comes to your clutch is that "expierementing" with different oils also causes you clutch to peform un predictably under harder riding conditions when it gets hot. Every wet clutch manufacture will tell you to "soak" your new clutch in the exact oil you are going to run befor you install it because of this.

architech
04-30-2009, 01:08 AM
Did not realize this. Therefore, I bought my bike used and don't know what's in the trans...I would like to change the oil. How do I know what to use? Is staying with the synthetic blend the safe thing to do?

stopie20
04-30-2009, 01:38 AM
architech


how many miles are on the bike. or.... is it possible to contact the previous owner to ask them?

architech
04-30-2009, 05:28 PM
Has about 7500 miles. Bought it with just unde 6k. Can't really contact the original owner, as I purchased it from a dealer that was selling a "trade in".

stopie20
04-30-2009, 05:49 PM
Well I would do the oil change replacing the oil with a quality synthetic blend wet clutch compatible oil. Then for the next 1000 miles or so pay very close attention to how your clutch operates look for slippage over a broad temp range and consistancy of operation, go out and really work it hard then see if it feels different under normal riding conditions.

If you feel a difference I would pick an oil and change your clutch friction plates at your next oil change. You may not notice anything and if thats the case you should pick an oil and stick with it.

maybebuell
04-30-2009, 10:39 PM
if the round seal on the oil bottle API service rating says energy conservation. then dont use it with the clutch..its that simple...try a real primary and tranny oil 75/90 primary same or heaver for tranny 75/140 syn or reg oil dont matter...

stopie20
04-30-2009, 11:54 PM
Maybebuell

That heavy oil may be ok for a "Harley", but it has no place in a buell primary... My years of racing expierence have taught me that clutches like light oil thats why buell does not spec the 75/90 you mention

Buell IS A SPORT BIKE and you ride it like A SPORT BIKE

"Harley philosophy need not apply"

chase12s
05-01-2009, 05:22 AM
75/90 is a definite no-no in the clutch/primary. I can guarantee you that. USE FORMULA+!

maybebuell
05-01-2009, 11:01 AM
same primary as a harley sportster ? and same tranny?...racing is one thing, street riding and longevity is another.....track a 10th of a sec on a lap is important thinner oil...

freezerburn
06-22-2009, 07:29 PM
I use mobil 1 15 50 car oil silver cap in crank and formula + in primary, or I use amsoil 20 50 v twin in both holes. I think however I like the Formula + in the Primary over the Ams, so I might as well stick with the mobil 1 15 50 car oil in the crank. Also Walmart sometimes has the gallons on sale for 22.00.

BRatigan
06-22-2009, 10:16 PM
I use AMSOIL synthetic in the primary and the engine to preserve the metal bearing surfaces and counteract the effects of heat or thermal breakdown. They have a 20/50 just for V-twins that meets my needs.

They have surpassed the other oils in real world testing and the facts of the tests proved to me that engine survival on a long term basis would be attainable if I used their product. Also note that
AMSOIL also prevents rust development in V-twins, especially in the off season storage environment.

If you do a search for "Bob is the oil guy" you will come to a website that covers the different oils and the test results.

BR

slomo2
08-13-2009, 07:33 PM
I wish i had found this thread earlier. I just bought Motul(100% Synthetic) 300V 15w50 for the engine and Castrol MTX synthetic (SAE 80W).

Are these acceptable or do i need to go back look for V-twin specific oil?

BRomanowski
08-13-2009, 09:12 PM
Now, what I dont know, I read the oil capacity numbers on the XB12s and that was 2.5qtsb but what i didnt find was any info on the primary capacity (except on here) after reading that you guys were running one qqt in your primary I added one qt to mine... well about 30 miles later I checked the oil level in the swing arm and the extra qt from the primary seemed to have migrated to the swingarm. I mean when I pulled the dipstick oil spued out of the top of the swing arm until I had about the full amount that I added on the ground. Whats up with that???

Stopie- Did you check the oil levels when you filled it? The primary and engine oils are separate. The primary should be up to the bottom of the clutch diaphragm spring and the swing arm should be in the middle range when warm. Did you maybe fill up the filter and put 2.5 in the arm?

TooFst
08-15-2009, 09:50 PM
Just switched from harley full syn 20w50 to mobil 1 15w50 cant tell a diference. I dont know what I was thought the diference would be but everything seems the same. Im sticking with mobil 1 cuz its easier 2 get

stopie20
08-15-2009, 10:23 PM
Yeah, I know they are supposed to be seperate, but it only happened once and the next oil change everything was normal... it was odd thats all.

On a seperate note, now that I have over 4,500 miles on the beast I am real close to putting straight 50 weight in it so I dont have to listen to the engine rattle on hot days..;)

bardo688
12-16-2009, 02:44 PM
Shake the rust off this thread
Bought by 03 9S with 5400miles ish dont know what oil was run is it
Couple of Dumb ?'s
Is it too late to change perminantly to Royal Purple or Mobile 1 20w50?
Living in SW Kansas it does get warm so iam sticking with the weight.
Any preference between the two? Cost?

Stevenc150
12-16-2009, 04:14 PM
Heard good things from both RP and Mobil 1. As long as it's full synthetic motorcycle oil, it's hard to argue which one is better. I personally use the RP 20W50 and am really pleased with it, but it costs a bit more than the Mobil.

bardo688
12-16-2009, 04:16 PM
Guess its mobil then is changing a pain?
Prolly wouldnt be a bad idea to run it a bit and test my new hawk pipe and stuff then let it cool a bit and change so it all cleans out smoother since its warmed up

Stevenc150
12-16-2009, 04:21 PM
Prolly wouldnt be a bad idea to run it a bit and test my new hawk pipe and stuff then let it cool a bit and change so it all cleans out smoother since its warmed up Yep, just like you described, besides the cool down part. Change while it's operating temp. if possible.

Changing oils in both engine & primary is a piece of cake. Service manual explains both clearly.

Remember checking engine (swingarm) level is done on sidestand. The Primary oil is with the bike standing vertical off the sidestand. You'll see it in the manual.

Edit: Clarified post

bardo688
12-16-2009, 04:24 PM
alright thanks again stevenc

bardo688
12-18-2009, 04:33 AM
nouther ?
How often does everyone change there oil...Just bought some Mobile1 V-twin(ya its all correct)20w-50 wondering how often everyone changes since your supposed to be able to run synthetic longer than every1 else? oh and i got a buell filter from BParts[up]

maybebuell
12-26-2009, 10:57 AM
i know people who change there oil every 1000 1500 to 5000 miles..what does the manual say..my metric says every 8000 miles so i go 4000

mcdonald1983
12-26-2009, 11:25 AM
My service manual shows every 5000

MAGIC
12-26-2009, 07:20 PM
I use Royal Purple Max Cycle 20W50 in primary and engine. Haven't had problems for almost 6 years now.

brightbuell
12-26-2009, 07:49 PM
Ok, so what was the final recommendation? Brand, Type, and Weight? I dont care about cost. They no longer make my 09 buell firebolt, so I want it to run as cool as possable with the least amount of wear. I am sure you all want the same so stop with the pissing contest and tell me![confused][confused][confused]

maybebuell
12-26-2009, 08:08 PM
there is no right answer... run what you like..all the oils are high quality and will do the job..buell motor rebuild on average is 50.000 mile,i dont care what you run for oil...want the motor to stay cool stay home

brightbuell
12-26-2009, 08:32 PM
I said as cool as possible!!!!!!! Possible!!!
Someone got a lump of **** for X-Mas.:D

maybebuell
12-27-2009, 03:07 AM
matter of fact i did get a lump of **** for x mas..and its still hot..im trying to cool that baby down myself

bardo688
12-27-2009, 05:50 AM
From what ive gathered Synthetic is best.
Royal Purple, Amisoil, Mobil-1, and the (cough) screaming eagle (since most people are sore about it me being one wouldnt take that route plus the other three beat it in wear contests)
Any of the three prefer changing oil as you feal necsasary (dumb 17yr old cant spell) prolly any where 4k-10k miles [smirk] if that helps any

delta one
12-27-2009, 06:42 AM
what does the clutch feel like if an auto oil was used instead of a motorcycle?

I had my bike fully serviced (along with tires and some mods) before I put it up but as it turns out the shop was full of idiots.

I rode it a bit before storing it and the clutch slipped more than I am used to.
the shop also moved my clutch cable, did they just throw my clutch out of adjustment or did they trash my clutch with the wrong oil?

bardo688
12-28-2009, 04:01 AM
Sorry just know that we need oil for a wet clutch...dont know nothing besides that at all

icepop77
12-28-2009, 12:15 PM
Here's an oil study done by some folks over at Sportster.org:

Oil Report (http://www.sportster.org/tech/OilandtheHarleyDavidsonMotorcycle.pdf)

chase12s
12-28-2009, 03:38 PM
I run Royal Purple and always will. I've found that it does keep the engine cooler than most others. If you can get ahold of it then get some syn3.

bardo688
12-28-2009, 05:16 PM
Changed oil in my 03 9s. ONLY dumped the plug infront of the swing arm and added.
Any other fluids you can change or should keep a good watch on?
Randy said to put a clamp on the lil organ thing in the front what fluid is in that?

icepop77
12-28-2009, 05:43 PM
Not to stir the pot, I'm just looking for what you guys are doing. Royal Purple vs Amsoil? I feel like there's no real difference at that point, both are high quality oils. Anyone running Amsoil? Just wondering.

delta one
12-28-2009, 05:52 PM
I use Amsoil in my bike. I have not used royal purple in my bike but it held up well in my Jetta.

HiwaymanKS
12-28-2009, 11:28 PM
I think this is one of the hottest topics on almost every forum concerning motorcycles. I run Amsoil in everything I own and have been very happy with it.

Obviously our air cooled motors produce a lot of heat and we need to run an oil that is formulated to withstand breaking down at high temps. Try going through Sturgis sometime and you will appreciate your oil a little better lol.

Additionally I think as long as you follow a few little rules there is no need to change oil nearly as often as we have been led to believe, just look at the guidlines for most high quality synthetics. We are talking 10,000 miles plus between changes which greatly reduces the cost of running a quality oil. (Amsoil will test your oil for you for a small fee should you want to test this, I did) Water is the biggest enemy of our oil / motor and since our motors produce approx a gallon of water for every gallon of fuel we burn ( everyone is running to wikipedia now lol ) and condensation is occuring everytime we let our motor cool down it is something we need to make sure we are aware of. If you can take a ride every week of 50 miles or more you greatly reduce the chances of water buildup / contamination and can run the extended oil changes. If you are primarily riding short distances you need to continue with more frequent oil changes. Obviously working on your motor requires you to do a break in cycle again.

As for me I just change the oil twice a year spring / fall because of the moisture and reduced riding in the winter and having multiple bikes just keeps it simple, unless of course one bike gets near the 10K limit for me and it usually happens at least once a year.

OK just my 2 cents.

boreas
01-03-2010, 01:44 PM
I run amsoil in all by bikes,but picked up a case of royal purple this week to try out:D,

pur pony
01-03-2010, 02:49 PM
I use and sell Amsoil. I have 20w50 in the bike with a Amsoil filter. Shift much better!

bolt08
01-03-2010, 04:07 PM
has anyone ever done anything with Red Line 20-50 full synthetic??
I had & still have a lot of luck with this stuff in my harleys.
It's not a generic - "same oil goes in every hole" synthetic. Instead, they have specific oil for motor, primary, & transmission (for bikes that require all three).

bolt08
01-03-2010, 05:42 PM
I just found this for anyone interested:

Choosing an Oil for Your Motorcycle

There are a few special problem areas for motorcycle oil. Most motorcycles have wet clutches, which means the motor oil runs through the clutch. If the motor oil has too much molybdenum in it, there are fears that the clutch can start slipping. No one I know has ever actually had this happen to them, but the warnings are all over your owners' manual and the oil companies' web pages. On the back of all certified oil cans is a circular stamp with the certification. Avoid oils that say "energy conserving" in the bottom half of the donut. These oils contain friction modifier additives that could cause clutch slipping over time. Essentially all 0w-20, 5w-30 and 10w-30 oils are energy conserving, and should not be used in your motorcycle.

Most motorcycles run the engine oil through the transmission, and the transmission gears are very hard on the oil's VII package. This means that over a couple thousand miles, the oil's viscosity can break down. Standard car oils are only good for typically 1500 miles before they've lost about half of their viscosity. Remember, 10w-40 oils contain a lot of VIIs which tend to shear in your transmission, so I believe 10w-40 oils should be avoided. You can't use 10w-30 because of the friction modifiers. This doesn't leave much. Commercial 15w-40 oils are a good choice, because they have relatively few VIIs which are the more expensive shear-stable sort. Synthetics typically don't contain much of a VII package, so shear is not as big an issue with them.

Some people use their motorcycles only sporadically. This means the oil can all drain completely into the sump, leaving no protective film on the bearings. The first start after a long period of non-use can be particularly hard on an engine. Film strength is very important if you're a sporadic rider.

There are several key advantages to using Synthetic Oils:

Synthetic oils have a higher viscosity index than mineral base oils. Synthetics have better resistance to thinning at high temperatures and thickening at low temperatures. Since synthetics have little or no VIIs, synthetics last longer in service without radical changes in viscosity.

Synthetics have a much higher film strength than petroleum oils, so it takes a lot longer for the oil to drain completely off your bearings and into your sump.

Diester synthetics are polar molecules with solvent properties which dissolve residues and combustion byproducts.




Here is the link to the whole article but I'll warn you, it's LONG!

all about oil (http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html)

Nofi
01-04-2010, 05:37 AM
Oh an oil thread!!

Here is my two cents worth. Do not base the quality of an oil on dyno test results. More HP does mean less friction and less friction means less heat, wear and power loss. There is a caveat however, race oils typically are formulated for performance which is not necessarily compatible with long term engine longevity. They are often lower in viscosity. Race engines are also built to tighter and closer tolerances which requires a thinner oil. Racers usually changed between races and have probably less than 70 miles on the oil, so 2,000 to 5,000 mile longevity is not an issue. For this type of use who cares about an oil's total base number.

In regard to MC oils vs. car oils. Most of the test data I have seen (for companies that make oil for both MC's and cars, i.e. Mobil 1) show little difference between them. It is just marketing hype (though the jury is not out regarding clutch compatibility). This is why I run Mobil 1 15W-50 car oil in my Buell engine and Mobil 1 20W-50 MC oil in the transmission and clutch.

MAGIC
01-07-2010, 01:29 AM
How much oil do I need for XB9S? Engine and primary.

Stevenc150
01-07-2010, 03:01 AM
Approximately 2.5quarts for Engine - 1 quart for the Primary.

Baal
01-07-2010, 03:21 AM
Gah. I know better than to even bump into an oil thread, but...

I went to the Red Line website and saw the separate 20W-50 engine oil, and the separate "transmission" and "primary" oils. He'p me out here:
Doesn't the primary and the transmission share the same oil on the XBs? If so, what the heck's the point? Is there a different supply on non-sportster-derived engines? I'm H-D unfamiliar.

RT Performance
01-07-2010, 03:30 AM
wow what a long thread adds my 2cents afer reading most of one page.
I use Mobile one 20w-50 v-twin.I buy it at auto zone.
I ran Royal purple for awhile the mobile one seems to burn off less and it's a couple dollars a quart less than i get rp with my commercial account from napa.
DO NOT PUT 10w-30 IN YOUR TRANS (as reccomended by Royal purple)
I am now putting m1 v twin with a few oz of Lucas into my trans and it works well

07Bolt
01-07-2010, 03:55 AM
yeah,,,the 20-50 Syn i run in my trans last for 5k, but 10-30 wouldnt go far at all...

MAGIC
01-07-2010, 02:44 PM
Approximately 2.5quarts for Engine - 1 quart for the Primary.

Thank you Stevenc150

Gonna order me some Royal Purple Max Cycle 20w50 for both

Stevenc150
01-07-2010, 04:07 PM
Nice, I use the same - Good stuff. [up]

Baal
01-08-2010, 04:12 AM
Lucas?

RT Performance
01-08-2010, 05:10 AM
Registered User
Currently Offline
Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 111
Reputation: 1
[?] User Rank: Captain

Lucas?
Engine oil stablizer.
good stuff and if you ever smelt the factory trans oil it has some gear oil in it.
http://www.lucasoil.com/

DrogeN Omen
03-26-2010, 03:03 AM
hmmm i'm with RT Performance on this...

i have checked my bike and bike manual for my 2007 Buell XB12SS and i cant find any other oil tanks other than the engine oil tank, so i am guessing that the Harley Davidson 20w50 oil i put in it last night does the whole bike - from Engine to Transmission to Gears.

not sure if it is cause bikes for my country (New Zealand) have been designed for the Australian/Asian market so might be different than the US market Buell's...[confused]

Riderdie
05-08-2010, 01:48 PM
Just put in some 20w50 screaming eagle, $28 from HD for two bottles and a filter.

Feels amazing though, almost embarrassing how black the old oil was.

No wonder, i thought the clutch cable was fraying but just old ass oil.

See how long the smooth shifts last.

tomcat
05-09-2010, 04:55 PM
hey guys, just changed the oil in my scg and definitely forgot to fill the oil filter half way before putting it on like the manual says. I already started it up and let it run for 15 min. Will I still be ok or should I take the filter back off and pour some in.

The manual for my last few streetbikes didn't say anything about filling the oil filter half way before installing so I just forgot to on my buell because I'm so used to doing it the other way. Will this cause any significant damage or will I be good until next time when I'll definitely remember?

Also, I used Lucas 20/50 synthetic race oil for motorcycles.

Alfatango1
05-09-2010, 06:19 PM
hey guys, just changed the oil in my scg and definitely forgot to fill the oil filter half way before putting it on like the manual says. I already started it up and let it run for 15 min. Will I still be ok or should I take the filter back off and pour some in.

If you take the filter off you'll need to put more the half the filter amount back in. How much do you think will come out of the crank case with the filter removed? Your filter is now full of oil. Just put maybe a 1/4 to a 1/2 cup into your bike or just check the level to see where it is. You weren't really going to pull the filter back off and put it in there where you? Or did you mean you were going to drain the new oil and start all over?

tomcat
05-10-2010, 12:28 AM
yea, I meant starting the whole process over before taking it out for a ride, but I found out I'd be fine as long as I do it by the manual from now on. Just rode it for over an hour and everything runs great. The buell just gets me paranoid as hell during regular maintenance tasks as I'm so used to my previous inlines.Thanks though alfatango1

303xb
05-10-2010, 12:40 AM
i have checked my bike and bike manual for my 2007 Buell XB12SS and i cant find any other oil tanks other than the engine oil tank, so i am guessing that the Harley Davidson 20w50 oil i put in it last night does the whole bike - from Engine to Transmission to Gears

Incorrect. There are 2 holes to fill. Swingarm (engine oil) and the primary inspection cover (trans/gears).

jrock
06-24-2011, 11:57 AM
xb 1203r firebolt. 7700 miles first oil change for the used 05
After reading all the post i am going to?

1.Use a 20/50 synthetic in rear and primary
2.put oil in filter before putting new one on
3.check oil in swingarm on stand, and primary vertical
4. 2.5 qt in rear and 1qt in primary.
???????????????????????
what am i doing wrong or what else should i do. I love this bike and want to do it right!

Alexrz5
09-01-2011, 12:38 AM
Sweet info!

thrstrmech
09-01-2011, 09:04 AM
Amsoil in mine, switched awhile back from HD synthetic, runs smooth:)

Doc Schlitzer
11-11-2011, 05:06 AM
all good infos, thanx doc

btek
01-13-2012, 01:36 PM
hey what oil weight would be best? When I ride in the mornings to work the temp is from around 2 celius/36 fahrenheit and on the way home 28 celcius/83 fahrenheit its a big tempature range it gets as hot as 33c/92f im plaining on using a synthetic not sure on brand yet tho.

BuckDaniels
01-13-2012, 10:32 PM
I put M1 Vtwin in both on my 2010 SS (previously hd oils).
Seems my front end got lighter.
This Mobil 1 must be lighter than the hd stuff..
(I dare not put this stuff in my forks or Ill need wheelie bars)

user_deleted
01-14-2012, 04:37 AM
jeesh!!! getting back on point here....i've mentioned it before and will mention it again...at least in the trans/primary i've found that bel-ray #75 and #80 gearsaver work wonderfully as well as motul synthese. the clutch action is smooth, the shifting is smooth, the primary chain is quiet, and decreased clunk going into first from a stop. readily available oils at competitive prices. to each his own.

livefstdieyng
09-05-2012, 12:05 AM
I don't mean to start another war here, but has anyone ever tried an oil additive in the primary case? I've been using a really great additive in the oil, but was hesitant to put in the primary case because of the wet clutch. Any insight?

oh9bolt
09-05-2012, 12:14 AM
I use oil as the additive.

g3stripes
09-05-2012, 02:07 AM
just curious how many people on here have worn a motor completely out.and what kind of oil were you running? how many miles?

go cytocis
09-05-2012, 05:11 AM
I have never worn a motorcycle engine out per se, but I did run up 100,000km on a little Honda 650 V-twin about a decade ago. Compression still tested well within spec and saw no signs of smoking. *I didn't follow a particularly rigorous schedule, I just replace the filter and 20w50 synthetic oil with whatever brand was on sale at roughly 10,000km intervals (usually annually in the fall).

In the Buell, I have run 20w50 synthetic engine oil & 75w90 gear oil for almost 20,000km now without any drama so far.

Some may claim my routine is inadequate, others may claim it's over kill. To them I say pick your oil as you would pick your religion and your politicians: chose something that allows you to sleep at night!

Typographical errors by*iPhone

user_deleted
09-05-2012, 11:18 AM
CHUCK NORRIS says Wolfs Head and by God, that's good enough for me.

g3stripes
09-09-2012, 12:25 AM
just wanted to see if anyone had done it since they all argue whats best! thanks for reply cytocis!

Dellinger
07-12-2014, 02:43 AM
Ok, I May have made a mistake. I have HD Syn3 in my XB12 and needed to add a small amount of oil but was out of Syn3 so I used a few ounces of MOBLE1 to top it off. I noticed what looks like small air bubbles on the dipstick when I checked the level later after running it some. Do I need to dump it and fill with new oil or am I just paranoid... The oil only has 1000 miles on it.[confused]

heagachongoose
07-12-2014, 03:25 AM
Some synthetic oil brands can be mixed although I highly advise against it. You are probably ok especially with it being a small amount. But if I were you I would immediately drain the engine and refill with a uniform oil so I knew for sure what was going on in there. Better safe than sorry. Like I said though. More likely than not, you are fine.

Now If you had mixed and ran a synthetic and non- synthetic oil...... You'd be in some ****.




Some big ****.















Big stinky ****.

Theycallmecrash
07-12-2014, 06:48 AM
Bull****

Mixing is perfectly fine.

Dellinger
07-12-2014, 07:42 AM
I feel like I'm talking to my wife. Mixed messages... I figured this question would start up a hole new controversy but I respect the opinions of those who've shared the same obsession as I. I've been a fan of BUELL for 20 years and kicked off my 40th with a XB12scg. I'm in love and don't want the affair to end abruptly due to a stupid mistake .

It's a commuter, I put 1000 miles on it the first 2 weeks I got it and have been racking up 75+miles daily for work not including missed exits and the thing I forgot at the store runs. The next and all other future oil changes will be AMSOIL. I have a gallon here, I just don't want to crack it till I have to.

heagachongoose
07-12-2014, 09:25 AM
Mixing is perfectly fine.

Crash is correct. I apologize for my misinformation and any confusion I may have caused. Mixing oils is fine. In some instances you may run a risk of additive degradation at the worst.

Wayne Kerr
02-15-2015, 06:50 AM
Soooo, after 3 days of reading a million oil threads on the Internet…

Canola Oil it is. Lol

Gloomshadow
02-17-2015, 10:31 PM
I don't know if any of you guys have messed with it, but I live in Florida and it gets hot as hell down here... I read the owners manual and saw SAE60 for anything over 80F so I asked my Harley techs about it and they told me to go over to Redline 20W-60 HD synthetic in both holes.. MAN THAT **** WORKS GOOD! Better than the Royal Purple 20w-50 and the Amsoil..quieted everything down, no popping .. much less consumption and the gearbox feels better too.. lasted a long time.. Im in Florida winter right now and no problems starting at all.. if you live in a hot climate, check out Redline 20W-60HD... its the ****!

Cooter
02-17-2015, 10:50 PM
I've got a pretty loud primary, and I live near you, so I'll check out the Redline 20W-60HD. Thanks for the info[up]

Gloomshadow
02-17-2015, 11:09 PM
yeah youll like it.. Ive tried all the recommended 20w-50.. they are good, but not THIS GOOD, not for us at least. Less heat coming off the motor and the fan doesn't come one like it did, good in traffic too. Youll feel the difference right away.. the Harley techs were right on this one.. its kinda chilly for Florida right now so let it warm up a few min before you take off... on the real cold days that I rode a felt a slight slip in the clutch for like first ten minutes of running but only under real hard acceleration, not a lot though, could have just been my imagination .. just give it a few min before you really get down on it.

Cooter
02-18-2015, 03:34 AM
just give it a few min before you really get down on it.

That's what she said….












:p

Risp
06-01-2015, 02:48 PM
OK, just picked up my second XB. XB12Stt this time. My first XB since moving to the Mojave Desert. It gets hot here in the summer, guaranteed low 90s minimum and average temps around low 100s daily. BUT... the mornings are quite nice, it can be as cool as low to mid 70s for the morning ride to work... by lunch though... it's HOT!

I assumed I'd run 20w-50 syn but opened the manual to be sure. Lo and be hold these bogus single SAE recommendations for temps above 80.

So I see on the various oil posts some people are running 20w-60 for hot weather. Well that's great. I guess I'm now thrown for a loop. It's less than 80 in the morning, but over a hundred by lunch. I ride at both of those times.

Late fall through spring it is actually quite nice here, always below 80, so that time of year I will stick with 20w-50.

Thoughts?

s0dhi
06-01-2015, 05:40 PM
20w-60 is fine for the loop that you're thrown.

A straight SAE60 weight might be an issue, but the the 20w60 is the same as 20w50 on the lower temp side of things.

Risp
06-01-2015, 06:20 PM
If 20w60 is the same as 20w50 on the left of the temp scale, then why not use 20w60 all the time instead of 20w50?

s0dhi
06-01-2015, 07:16 PM
If 20w60 is the same as 20w50 on the left of the temp scale, then why not use 20w60 all the time instead of 20w50?

Availability in your favourite brand, no need for the 60 weighting, you live in a place that actually has seasons and you also use 10w40. The reasons may be many.

GregoXB
06-01-2015, 10:16 PM
I rode on 20w50 in 10 degrees Fahrenheit, and in 99 degrees Fahrenheit. I can report that the oil handled it very well. Don't over think it.

Lusiphur
06-02-2015, 12:34 AM
I just drained Mobile1 vTwin 20w50 Synthetic out of my XB12R. It had 5000 miles on it.
It looked fine. After reading this thread, I wish I got it tested to provide some non subjective facts on how it did.
But, from a subjective point of view, it looked great and the bike shifts very well.
As such, I filled both holes with the same and re-wired tied the drain plugs.

it's easy to get. Funny thing is, when I was at my Local Harley Dealer to pick up my spark plug wires, I noticed that the HD oil is actually cheaper by a small amount. So for once, HD isn't over pricing something just because it has HD on it.

Gloomshadow
06-02-2015, 04:03 PM
no HD oil IS overpriced.. its basically on par with Walmart brand oil.

To answer the question "why not just use 20w-60 all year long?".. I DO. I run it all year long in Florida and its fantastic. It runs real quiet and smooth compared to Amsoil 20w-50.

You don't see Redline 20w-60HD mentioned much, its a harder to find weight and I usually have to order it online.. S&S makes one too If memory serves. I don't think 20w-60 has been around that long.. and only a few of the premium motorcycle oil brands make one.. I ran into some Harley guys that didn't believe that weight even existed when I mentioned it. The new thing now is 10w-60 for 4-cycle motocross bikes and Superkarts.

Risp
06-02-2015, 06:36 PM
What filter are you running with that Redline 20w60? I'm eye balling the WIX XP which is for full synthetic and extreme/hot conditions.

Gloomshadow
06-02-2015, 11:43 PM
K&N filter..

WiredForStereo
06-03-2015, 04:02 PM
Forget the numbers on the bottle, look at the actual viscosities at different temperatures.

When they're cold there can be quite large differences in the viscosity. When they're hot, the differences in viscosity are quite small. It seems to me there's a benefit to lower cold viscosity, getting the oil moving in the engine quicker and easier. I wouldn't touch straight 60 weight. It's cold viscosity is way high, but hot viscosity is just a few units above a 50 which is just a few units above a 40. Most engine damage is done when the engine is cold. When the engine is hot, you have to seriously stress it to break the oil film and have metal to metal contact.

Gloomshadow
06-03-2015, 08:23 PM
you can always do what they do in Brazil.. run 20w-30.. watch what happens.

GregoXB
06-04-2015, 07:46 PM
IDK, 20w50 works just fine. I think we are over thinking it. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Gloomshadow
06-04-2015, 10:54 PM
depends on your ambient temperature.. just read the owners manual. Ive tried the best 20w-50 out there for YEARS... 20w-50 is nothing like 20w-60 in hot weather.. no comparison. .. it was BROKE, I fixed it. Buell owners manual is correct, above 80 degrees you should be running 60 weight.. been there , done that

Gloomshadow
06-04-2015, 11:44 PM
IM not trying to be a dick or put out bull**** information to the group. I ran 20w-50 Amsoil full synth in both my XB9 and my XB12 for YEARS here in Florida. Its good oil but when it gets above 80F and you start pushing 100F that 20w-50 would get real noisy and start misting out of my breather by passes real pretty bad, I could feel it was running bad.
So I went over to this **** right here

and I run it across all temperature ranges in Florida with not a single issue..

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=111

Read up on this **** boys, this is what you need to be running...its MUCH nicer and the side of my swing arm doesn't get misted up with gunk anymore from my bypass.. just runs smooth and strong.

Risp
06-05-2015, 02:47 AM
Gloom. what are you running in your primary?

Gloomshadow
06-05-2015, 04:04 AM
20w-60HD Redline..

BambamXB12r
06-05-2015, 04:32 AM
+1 Redline 20w-60HD in my Uly and Firebolt.
Always 90+ degrees in the summer time here and 20w-50 wasn't cutting it.

Gloomshadow
06-05-2015, 01:30 PM
feels like its giving you about 5 horsepower back

BambamXB12r
06-05-2015, 02:44 PM
Yes, also runs much smoother at heigh temps.

Gloomshadow
06-05-2015, 05:40 PM
yell yeah.. I just off a 50 mile ride with my 9SX, pulled into the garage and shut it off.. fan didn't even kick on and its gotta be 90 degrees out right now.. Amsoil 20w-50 wasn't like that.

DSHUMAKER
06-05-2015, 10:36 PM
So its getting to be 90+ degrees here and the humidity is killer. I've been able to find 70 wt oil but not 60 where I'm at has anyone used anything that heavy?

Gloomshadow
06-05-2015, 11:56 PM
no I wouldn't do it man, just order some Redline off ebay if you have to.. they got it online. I ordered some and it came in like 3 days. I think I found a Florida seller.

Gloomshadow
06-05-2015, 11:58 PM
Id make sure you got a high-flow oil filter too just to be sure..... Im running a K&N.. but factory specs call for SAE60 and a stock Buell filter so it should be ok but I would rather be high-flow than "ok flow"...

Gloomshadow
06-06-2015, 12:06 AM
you can get it online through Revzilla... quarts and Gallons.. price isn't bad either

DSHUMAKER
06-08-2015, 12:35 AM
So I was near a Harley Davidson dealer today and picked up a few quarts of HD 60w oil. They had it for $7.00 a quart at that price I figured I would give it a shot. If I have to dump it and use something else I'm not out small fortune. The temp here today was in the mid 80 's with the humidity it hit the 90 's. I changed the oil and took her for a ride and got her good and hot. I noticed a huge difference from the get go she sounds like a new bike. I've never heard her so quiet and she seemed to have more grunt. So far I'm very happy with the way she's running.

Gloomshadow
06-08-2015, 12:55 AM
oh yeah, the Buell Manual aint bull****ting... 60 weight is no joke.

DSHUMAKER
06-08-2015, 01:15 AM
I figured it would do until I can get my local shop to carry a 20-60w oil year round I figure I'll have to call the ams rep that they go through and sweet talk him.

Gloomshadow
06-08-2015, 01:23 AM
the Redline 20w-60 is good ALL ,..YEAR .. ROUND... no joke. (at least in the South) I used it down to 50F with no problems.
I got a carbon right side scoop for my 12 on order and I think Im good to go now.. that combo on my 9 totally fixed any heat issues I had... Im hoping it carries over to the 12 the same way.

DSHUMAKER
06-08-2015, 01:32 AM
I have the right and left scoop on my xb12ss and she still runs a bit on the hot side but it does seem a bit cooler than it did before I added the right side scoop. I ride it like I stole it most of the time that keeps her good and hot. I temped the jugs on it after my ride today front was at 235 and rear 240.

Gloomshadow
06-08-2015, 01:54 AM
That's good.. I got a laser also, I will start taking readings. So, with the two scoops and the 60sae, she felt good at about 90F.. that's good to hear. My 9 is solid with that setup way up to about 95-100F.. if it gets any hotter than that I tend to want to stay in the A/C anyway.

DSHUMAKER
06-08-2015, 02:00 AM
yeah when it over 100 it's time to have a cold drink and play xbox with the kids. If I do ride I think I'll bust out the little cbr250r she doesn't get nearly as hot as the xb12.

Gloomshadow
06-08-2015, 02:39 AM
yep, and if its under 50 or so, Im like "**** it".. hahahah

ocgreenmachine
06-08-2015, 06:25 PM
Anyone from the Southern California area running 20w-60? And your experience with it? I'm running 20w-50 synthetic (royal purple/castrol/Mobil 1 have all been into my bike).

Gloomshadow
06-08-2015, 09:38 PM
if California can overheat a Ducati Diavel in traffic, go ahead and get it..

GregoXB
06-08-2015, 10:19 PM
Rode my Lightning in 100 degree weather in traffic, weaving in and out at 10-30mph, and then at 80 mph for extended lengths. Bike ran like a Rolex on 20w50.

BambamXB12r
06-08-2015, 10:43 PM
Just got another case. I personally ride all year round. From the 30s to 115 out here in Vegas. Haven't used in the middle of winter because I usually go back to 20w-50 for when I camp in the mountains but couldn't imagine doing anything else when summer hits.
http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/19992_20150608173444_L.jpg

GregoXB
06-09-2015, 12:07 AM
In the winter you'd probably want to change it out to 10w40 if you are going to see temps below 40F. When it hits between 40F-60F change it out to 20w50. When it goes above 60F put SAE 50. When it goes above 80F use SAE 60, or I guess you can do the 20w60 (although it's not recognized in the owner's manual). Pay close attention to the forecast, use Accuweather and try to average out the temperature range and adjust the oil accordingly. If you live in the Northeast, temps range between 0F-100F, so yea, have fun with that.

OR..... you can ignore that entire paragraph, poor in 20w50, grab a beer and enjoy your next 3k miles.

ReadyXB
06-09-2015, 12:52 AM
Is there no one who uses HD-360 20W-50? lol :)

Gloomshadow
06-09-2015, 01:56 AM
Riding motorcycle below 40F?? that doesn't exist in Florida. I ride at 50F with 20w-60HD, NO PROBLEM.. don't knock it until you try it.

djs2k2
06-09-2015, 01:58 AM
Um, how can I say this? Not many people pro-HD anything here! It's not an opinion but more of a fact.

Gloomshadow
06-09-2015, 02:02 AM
I have friends that have worked inside Harley.. and they wont run it. They thought it was basically generic oil with a Harley label on it. I don't know its true though

GregoXB
06-09-2015, 02:13 AM
Try a different oil every oil change till you find the one that works for you. It's like Goldie locks and the porridge.

djs2k2
06-09-2015, 02:14 AM
Sounds like a good enough rumor to start for me[up]! No I stopped using screaming eagle full synthetic when the Harley shop tested it against amsoil and they told me my bike was running 10 degrees cooler, that was at new river Harley, so they were stand up guys to go against their company! +1[up]

Gloomshadow
06-09-2015, 02:20 AM
knowing how Harley merchandises it wouldn't surprise me if it was true.. I don't have anything against their motorcycles though.. they are what they are.. and some of the look damn fine doing what they do.. Im just not sure if I trust the guy who is running the show over there right now.. I think we pretty much know where his heart is.. if you want to call it a heart.

GregoXB
06-09-2015, 02:23 AM
lol

Risp
06-12-2015, 04:33 AM
I'm going to change the oil tomorrow with Redline 20W60 since it's in the 100s here in the Mojave Desert now. I'll let you all know how it works out in extreme dry heat.

Risp
06-12-2015, 04:42 AM
Incidentally, I contacted Redline to see what their 2015 recommendation is for the XB. The official word: Redline 20W50 for the engine & Redline 75W90 GL-5 for the primary. They "approved" the use of Redline 20W60 for my location but only if it helped me sleep at night. That's interesting to me... I live not too far from Death Valley, if Redline doesn't recommend 20W60 there, then why are they making it?

I also grilled them on the 75W90 primary recommendation. Bottom line, Redline says their testing yielded the best results using their baseline 75W90 GL-5. No it won't hurt yellow/red metals as they've formulated it not to. Yes you could run Redline 20W50 in the primary if you wanted too, but it's not their recommendation.

Gloomshadow
06-12-2015, 11:26 AM
good to know.. run that 20w-60HD.. ive probably tested it longer than they have.. no kidding
Ill probably try that gear oil soon enough

but yeah, that's funny, their own literature goes on about how 20w-60 is great for high performance stroked and bored bla bla bla HD V-twins in hot weather then some guy busts in with "well you don't really NEED IT".. yeah BULL****.. run the 60 its awesome

vtwinjunkie
06-12-2015, 12:03 PM
I will have to give that a shot. Been using the valvoline 20w50 MC oil in both engine and Primary...but I want to try the redline...

realy interested to see how the GL5 will hold up in the gearbox...its a bit clunky with the current oil.

Gloomshadow
06-12-2015, 12:27 PM
"You shall ride eternal .. SHINY AND CHROME!"

http://giphy.com/gifs/road-max-fury-12xHxoPxYE11WU

WiredForStereo
06-12-2015, 03:40 PM
They do the V-8 sign in Mad Max, what's the V-twin sign, specifically, the 45 degree air cooled v-twin sign?

DSHUMAKER
06-12-2015, 03:59 PM
I've been running the HD 60w in mine for about a week now the bike runs great. I have 20-50 in the primary and it's about due for a change. I have been hitting up the local shops for the 70-90 I'm going to give it a shot when it's time. The local shop that I get my odds and ends from is going to get the ams 20-60 and have some in stock just for me!!

Gloomshadow
06-12-2015, 06:26 PM
Maker: good.. tell us the legend of the Amsoil after you use it.. its good that everyone knows what all the other 20w-60's are like.. if its all good.. its all good and we got more options.

Stero: its the same sign.. V-8 is the Father, V-Twin is the Son... Forced Induction is the Holy Sprit..

DSHUMAKER
06-12-2015, 08:04 PM
I will I'm sure it's as good as all of the other ams products.

DSHUMAKER
06-12-2015, 08:57 PM
from the looks of it the ams might just be a straight 60w I thought I read somewhere they did a 20-60w too I think I miss read it.

Gloomshadow
06-12-2015, 10:33 PM
Im telling you. I ran amsoil full synth 20w-50 it was real good.. but the Redline HD tops it for hard use in at all temps that I tested ... no need for any unnecessary loyalty to Amsoil.. go for the Redline.. try that gear oil in the primary too, tell us about it.

DSHUMAKER
06-12-2015, 11:28 PM
I'm not loyal to any oil I've had ams, lucas and HD in it since I bought her in January but I do think the 20-60w would be better in the cooler months too.

Gloomshadow
06-12-2015, 11:44 PM
it is.. it feels like the bike has more endurance.. you run it hard and it doesn't even seem to notice.

GregoXB
06-12-2015, 11:54 PM
The best choice is the oil that outperforms the others in laboratory analysis and testing.

"Werks purty gud" and "try 'er out"...... by default, that will be the less popular choice.

Gloomshadow
06-13-2015, 04:47 AM
60 weight is recommended by the factory at temps above 80F...

Dellinger
06-15-2015, 02:10 AM
I didn't realize I should be using 20 w 60 in this hellish 100 degree weather . I just purchased some redline on Amazon. I'll do the fill when I redo the leaky base gaskets with the Cometic top end kit. I was planing on filling both holes with it. Should I use something else for the primary?

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 02:26 AM
its what I am using .. Redline says you can do it but they recommend the gear oil they make... I think it was 75-90

GregoXB
06-15-2015, 05:14 PM
https://www.amssyntheticoil.com/images/TEOST.pnghttp://www.superoilcentral.com/images/mct-4ball.jpghttp://www.amsoil.com/graphs/dominator/RD30_FourBall_900.jpg

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 05:53 PM
I mentioned previously that I was going to try the Amsoil 5w-50. I did, 600 mile trip so far, I was pleasantly surprised by the significant increase in fuel economy, better than I've gotten ever so far. Absent better evidence, I'm crediting the friction modifiers. Posted about it here: http://www.buellxb.com/Buell-XB-Forum/Buell-Ulysses-XB12x/Sudden-Increase-in-Fuel-Economy

Also, the 60 weight recommendation has been brought up repeatedly for temps over 80F. This needs to be clarified, that's for LOW TEMPS over 80F. If your low temp is over 80F, then you should use 60 weight. I think a few are misreading it a bit. Here in Denver, my low temp is never above 80, so I won't be using it in the engine. However, I might try it in my primary after I run out of 20W-50, which will be after about two years.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 05:53 PM
Grego.. this has nothing to do with oil pressure...

Stero.. ah .. no. The only problem with SAE60 is that its difficult to start at very low ambient temperatures. ,,but 20w-60 is exactly the same as 20w-50 for low temperature starting. Once the motor and the oil is up to temperature that's when it becomes 60 weight. You can run 20w-60 at cool temps .. they even make a 10w-60 for cold staring at even lower temps. The only reason why 20w-60 isn't mentioned in the manual is because HARLEY doesn't make a 20w-60.. the manual is specifically recommending that you use HARLEY brand oil .. hahahah that's Walmart level ****
also "friction" is not going to be a huge factor with this motor.. the XB motor is very "loose" tolerances.. its just held in suspension by oil pressure.. that's why the weight goes up.. you need to keep the oil pressure high and the oil pump can keep thick oil pressurized at high temps easier than it can a thin oil. Only thing you wanna watch for with 60 in low temperature is you need to use a high flow filter to make sure you flow of oil is good.. you don't want more oil coming out of the crankshaft then going in..

GregoXB
06-15-2015, 06:05 PM
Engine temperature is really what matters. Ambient temps are a minor factor, to the point of being insignificant. When you have an oil rated to protect up to 400F, 10-20 degrees on the thermometer is almost insignificant.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 06:10 PM
so, why does the manual specifically state "AMBIENT TEMPERATRE"?

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 06:18 PM
Gloom, I didn't mention 20w-60, I mentioned 60 weight in the context of the manual. I do all my viscosity choices based on the actual viscosity at operating temp and actual cold viscosity, which is one main reason why I use 5w-50. Same hot viscosity as the 20w-50, but quite a bit thinner when cold. I wouldn't want something as thick as a straight 60 trying to start up in anything I own at any temperature. All my vehicles go with the recommended hot viscosity and as low a winter viscosity as is available.

Grego, your bike gets up to 400F? My oil is pretty consistent, 80-95C with a thermometer dipstick. However, I do understand that the head gets quite a bit hotter than that. Amsoil did a test with a Harley engine up to above 500F, if I remember correctly.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 06:30 PM
If you are in cool weather (and cool weather for me is 60-70F) . you wont NEED 20w-60 but you can still run it...
if you are in hot weather you can run 20w-50 but you actually NEED 20w-60

just all my studies with these motors and my personal experience confirms this. The 60 runs better in hot weather, period, no one is going to change my mind on this one, I used the best 20w-50 known to man it still wasn't really cutting it in the Florida summer .. especially in traffic. Especially if your bike is a 1203 and even more if its running a hot state of tune. My 984 isn't as bad as my 1203 in the heat but yeah.. even my 984 improved a lot once I switched over to 20w-60HD.. even S&S makes one like Redline 20w-60.. that's why they made them.

GregoXB
06-15-2015, 06:38 PM
The point is, if you have an oil rated to protect up to 500F, like you say, it does not matter if its 100F or 70F outside. A normal engine will operate between 200-260F. Changing oils for +/- 10 weight, is a bit OCD.

Even on the cold spectrum, 20 weight turns over just fine even when the temp is in the teens. I can even confirm that based on my experience. If you ride in sub-teen weather, then a 5 weight may be necessary for initial starting, but honestly if you are riding in those temps, you should be more concerned about not losing your fingers.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 06:40 PM
when I say "60 weight" Im actually talking about 20w-60.. I wouldn't run SAE60 unless I was in the Florida summer or hotter and that's all I could find... youre going to have to go back to 20w-50 when the season changes. But for the South 20w-60HD can cover you all year around unless you are one of those guys that HAS to go out and ride at 40-50F... to me that's cold.. im like **** IT im staying in..

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 06:47 PM
Redline 20w-60 has a 100C viscosity of 23. Amsoil 5w-50 has 20.3 at the same temperature. That's not a big difference.

Meanwhile, at 40C, Redline has 177 while Amsoil has 127. That's a huge difference.

Since most wear happens at start-up, that's my focus. These engines are loud mechanically, but in my view, that's really irrelevant compared to the issue of wear.

Not trying to convince you in any way to switch away from your favorite oil, just pointing out the facts.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 06:59 PM
the "facts" don't matter .. only the results matter. You put 20w-60 in there in hot weather and it runs a lot better.. other guys here that use it will also attest to this.

GregoXB
06-15-2015, 07:10 PM
The Buell and Harley community run 20w50.
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/engine-oils-lubrication/56313-new-oil-poll.html
Sure the majority of us run 20w50, but honestly what would we know? Feel free to experiment all you want. But remember, in the words of the late/great Carl Sagan....

http://www.troll.me/images/carl-sagan/no-empirical-evidence-g-t-f-o.jpg

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 07:31 PM
It depends on ambient temp.. the manual says anything above 80F use SAE60 (20w-60HD is also rated). It runs better than amsoil 20w-50 at temps above 80F (and it runs great below 80F too)... that is my evidence . What you own stock in 20w-50 or something?

Lets see your bike Grego.. post a video.

most guys use 20w-50 because the live in fairly cool climates plus there is a "monkey see monkey do" effect.

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 07:36 PM
"The 'facts' don't matter."

I'm with Sagan on this one.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 07:48 PM
I worked in the legal industry and the sales business.. "facts" are usually MADE INTO FACTS.. my bosses used to make 'FACTS' all the time hahahah

besides, what I am doing is just what the Buell factory manual says.. its working so Im with Sagan on that one too.

you too Stero, lets see that XB, how long have you had it?

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 08:13 PM
if you are going to get into this group and start recommending that people disregard Buell Factory recommendations, youre gonna have to put your rep on the line and show us what youre working with. .. lets see those bikes, lets hear them run and lets see your oil results at the recommended ambient temperatures to give us a reason NOT to follow factory recommendations. Also you must provide empirical evidence proving to me that my bike was running better and feeling better when I was running 20w-50 Amsoil full synth at 80F plus degrees versus this 20w-60HD... EMPRICAL EVIDENCE THAT MY BIKE RAN BETTER WHEN I DISREGAURDED FACTORY RECOMMENDATIONS.

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 08:19 PM
You'll find I have only recommended one thing, strict adherence to the Buell manual in the case of the use of SAE 60 weight oil.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 08:30 PM
Im running 20w-60... that's how it is.
I would not recommend running 5W- even in cold weather. the oil pressure during start up may not be enough. It would probably work but your risking increased engine wear on those bearings. The tolerances are loose, and you need oil pressure. This is an air-cooled motor.. its not "tight" tolerances like a liquid cooled.

s0dhi
06-15-2015, 08:50 PM
From the manual for my 2009:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/28846604/BuellManualOil.PNG

It doesn't explicitly say run SAE60 for 80F. It says if your lowest temperature is 80F, go head and run SAE60. It seems that the manual recommendations are based on starting the bike more than anything else.

The way I read that is, "Don't use SAE60 if the temperature can dip below 80F." But then again that's a single weight oil.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 09:02 PM
exactly.. and the reason is SAE wouldn't be that good during a cold start below 80F but we got a guy using it right now, he can probably tell us more, I bet is fine down to about 60F... if its 20w-60 all bets are off.. cold start is the same as 20w-50. 20W-60 wasn't on the list because Harley doesn't make one and they want Buell to sell Harley oil for them.. on the list also it says "HD" brand oil.. HARLEY! hahah

now if you look at Redline or S&S 20w-60, they are all saying that its what you want to use in hot weather for smooth operation and its good for bored and stroked high performance Harley . Also knuckleheads .. its just good **** .. you gotta try it out in hot weather before you can really understand it.. go back a few pages and read what that first time user of SAE60 said.. also they guy way out in the desert is running Redline 20w-60... I put Redline probably up above Royal Purple too.. I tried it , good but not as good as this

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 09:28 PM
Oil pressure at cold is really irrelevant. Oil flow is the more important. We have an air cooled engine with roller bearings, with a high flow low pressure regime. High pressure and thick oil when cold just means the pump is having more trouble pushing the oil through the engine. I want the oil to move quickly and relatively unimpeded. When the engine heats up, it's going to be far far thinner anyway and it won't really matter anymore. I'd buy a 0w-50 if it was available. All my vehicles run 0w-XX no matter what they call for (except the Buell since Amsoil doesn't sell anything lower than 5w-50). My oldest car is 10 years old, bought new. Zero engine problems, 220,000 miles.

The hot weather viscosity is also mostly irrelevant within a range. SAE 40=14 cSt, 50=20 cSt, 60=23 cSt. Whereas when cold there is a huge difference between 0w, 5w, 10w, and 20w. I really could give a rip about the number on the bottle. I'm interested in the actual viscosity rating, the additive package, and the longevity of the engine. Not really concerned about engine noise, I wear ear plugs and have a loud exhaust. I also ride a bike with a Harley engine, which says something in itself.

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 09:42 PM
It was my local Harley / Buell qualified factory tech that recommended Redline 20w-60HD to me in the first place. Ok I gotta go.. later

Gloomshadow
06-15-2015, 10:28 PM
Just to set the record straight for you guys that live in hot climates like Florida, Texas ect... check this link all the others about Redline 20w-60HD for use in Harley or Buell motors. Feel free to google away on it and make up your own mind. I have no vested emotional issues in oil , I just tried all the best 20w-50s out there and in my climate 20w-60 was the best one for my situation
check this one and all the many other discussions about Redline by guys WHO HAVE ACTUALLY USED BOTH OILS!
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/engine-oils-lubrication/218751-red-line-20w60-part-531187-a.html
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/v-twin-forum-general-harley-talk/40529-redline-20w60hd.html

WiredForStereo
06-15-2015, 11:20 PM
Hmm, I thought some Amsoil guys were over the top. Looks like Redline takes the cake today.

DSHUMAKER
06-16-2015, 01:59 AM
Ok so I've been running the HD 60w in my xb12ss for the Last few weeks. What i can say is the bike runs better WHEN hot compared to the 20-50 I had in it. The starts have been about the same. it's usually in the 70's when I get up for work. With the 20-50w oil at 80+ degrees outside the jugs would temp at close to 300 degrees after a HARD ride. The 60w oil seems to run cooler when I temp the jugs taking the same path and riding just as hard the temp is in the 260 degree range. I'm not saying one oil is better than the other just that MY bike likes the heavier oil in the heat and doesn't sound like she's going to fly apart when I twist on the gas hard. As you all know opinions are like ass holes..... everybody has one.

Gloomshadow
06-16-2015, 02:11 AM
sing it brother.

where is Risp? hes out in the Mojave and just went over to it... where you at Risp?

Risp
06-16-2015, 03:53 AM
Alas... I haven't been able to get out on road since the switch! Just got back from a personal trip and now going straight back out on a business trip! I should be able to report back this weekend. I'm also giving the Redline gear oil a shot too based on Redline's recommendation.

Gloomshadow
06-16-2015, 01:43 PM
I have been thinking about going over to gear oil for a while... if it cuts it out in that heat Ill take the plunge.

GregoXB
06-16-2015, 03:12 PM
Forget what oil manufacturers recommend, with their fancy schmancy labs and scientific experiments, pshh. Come to the forums where the real science happens.

Tbone
06-16-2015, 05:07 PM
I run Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 in the Summer, and Mobil 1 15w-50 (Silver Cap, Nascar approved) in the winter for the last 3 years in Dallas Tx. Both Holes no problems. I find myself using the 15w-50 more since it is $23.88 for 5 Quarts and My Uly runs quieter, cooler, Wheelieability feels the same, that is my scientific measuring instrument.
I just adopted a sister, 2007 White Tiger 1050, for my Uly and just put Mobil 1 15w-50 and it is running well for the last 1000 Miles. PO had left a Mobil 1 oil filter on there, so I am confident that is the oil they used. Yes I had the Tiger for a week and already a thousand miles.

DSHUMAKER
06-16-2015, 05:15 PM
And the manufactur recommended oil for 80 degrees and above is 60w oil. That's what some of us use with good results.

Gloomshadow
06-16-2015, 06:05 PM
the manufacturer is correct... leaving amsoil 20w-50 behind was the best choice Ive made so far with both my XBs in Florida. For cooler climates its a good oil but for hot climate 60 is where its at. You have to actually use both oils before you can form an opinion.

oil manufacturers are 'MANUFACTURERS".. they are in the sales business. They are always going to tell you that their **** is the best for everything. The street and real world results are where the knowledge is.

Tbone
06-16-2015, 06:33 PM
I am no oil scientist, but if I can get Mobil 1 15W-50 for just over $4 a quart, or Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 for $8/$9 a quart to change the oil myself. Why would I spend $14 or more a quart? Or even $12 a quart. That will take a whole lot of science to override a little bit of common sense. I do not think my brain can overcome this as my hands are too busy changing the oil. Unless some better oil shows up on a shelf for a cheaper price, or I have some money to burn, I will rely on common sense/science that clean oil is better than dirty oil in all circumstances.

Gloomshadow
06-16-2015, 06:42 PM
Tbone, I feel ya man.. I ran amsoil 20w-50 full synth for like 4 years in both my 12 and my 9.. it was good oil for most of the year but dog-days dead of summer in Florida, it wasn't cutting it.. especially in traffic. I gave Redline 20w-60HD a shot (Harley Davdison blend) and I walked away ****ing impressed. Big , air-cooled pushrod motors in hot weather were the target of that oil and Redline succeeded. With your Tiger you are probably good to go that's a liquid cooled motor and 50 is enough... but give Redline 20w-60HD a shot in one of your 1203's and see what happens.

Gloomshadow
06-16-2015, 06:49 PM
if you don't want to spend the money just do what DSHUMAKER did and just drop some cheap "straight" 60 in there this summer and check it out.. you wont have a problem running SAE60 down to 60-70F in the real world anyway. DUSHUMAKER can attest .. Ive never run that oil but I know what he is talking about.. its the same basic effect.

GregoXB
06-17-2015, 04:54 AM
Real world scenarios are extremely difficult to gauge. You want to go with something that is proven. If 9/10 people are telling you what the best choice is, then it behooves you to listen. Just because user Vtwin69 from the forums says its okay, you should probably take that with a grain of salt. It's like common sense, you know?

Tbone
06-17-2015, 01:41 PM
OK, I went another route. Just did a Mobil 1 20W-50 V-Twin oil change and displaced 14 oz of engine oil with MMO. Did NOT use MMO in the primary, imagine it would screw up the clutch. Immediately noticed a change in how quiet and smoothly it idles, accelerates, starts easier as well. When the weather clears up I will ride it in rush hour traffic to see how it does in the heat, MPG, etc..? I used MMO in the buell crankcase after personally using it in 3 other family vehicles with excellent results:
1. 2002 Accord 2.3L 232Kmiles, MMO fixed leaking front and rear main seals after 2 oil changes, wife's car.
2. 2000 Sable 3L DOHC 134Kmiles MMO fixed oil pooling in intake manifold causing leaking intake gaskets. 1 oil change in Daughter's car.
3. 2003 Express Van 5.3 L 226Kmiles MMO fixed or broke nothing. 2 oil changes but do notice increased MPG. I am original owner.
After $23.75 invested so far for 5 qts of MMO I have became the Master of my Family's Vehicle Universe! Hope this pays off for Father's day. I say it will take a whole lot more science to change my reality, but again I am not an oil scientist, i do not own a dyno, or have a race track, a UOA lab. I am an average Joe, with an 85 mile commute everyday, on a pager, and try my best to keep things running well. So far I am kicking a$$ and on top of it, will let you know if something goes wrong but currently all is running excellent, tightly sealed, and no smoke!

Gloomshadow
06-17-2015, 03:18 PM
Grego... SAE60 IS PROVEN.. they have been using that **** all the way back to the stone age.. some Harley guys even use 70 weight in the old Knuckleheads. As the ambient temp rises, the weight of the oil should rise.. this is old school biker knowledge going way back.

Gloomshadow
06-17-2015, 03:22 PM
tbone: do what you gotta do.. but MMO is basically wintergreen oil and naptha.. if you think it works than you think it works but just throwing some cheap SAE60 like the manual tells you to would probably be cheaper and more effective.. every time I think "cheaper" my teeth hurt.. "cheaper" always ends up being more expensive in the long run in my experience.

Gloomshadow
06-17-2015, 03:53 PM
I agree with these guys.. http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/engine-oils-lubrication/183705-sae-60-vs-20w50-summer-2.html

Dellinger
06-17-2015, 06:03 PM
This forum is awesom!

Sagan vs 20w60. Manual vs manufacturer recommendation. What next?

I have buddies who have been trying to talk me into Redline for a wile. 2 of them use 20w60, the other 20w50. They have hi mileage machines with great reliability, this is why I'm going Redline.

GregoXB
06-17-2015, 11:23 PM
A very good additive for engine oil is lard. You want to add about 3 tablespoons in 2.5 quarts. It's a cheap alternative and it increases oil viscosity at high temperatures. Bonus, when you check your oil you do not need to wipe the dipstick with a rag, you can lick it off, it's ****en delicious.

Risp
06-18-2015, 04:47 AM
The charts on pg 7 of this thread are missing info such as subject engine, oil specifics, etc. One of the charts was a test of 30 weight oils which dosn't really apply here... The needed test would be at ambient temps greater than 80F, with a representative engine, using the subject oils.

Risp
06-18-2015, 04:49 AM
I haven't got to ride with the 20W60 yet but was happy to find something that makes sense for the scorching temps in the Mojave...

Risp
06-18-2015, 05:02 AM
Incidentally, I contacted Amsoil regarding their most current recommendation for oils in temps 80F+. For the primary they are recommending their new V-twin transmission oil instead of 20w50 for hotter temps... See below.

Me "I'm in the Mojave Desert where ambient temps are around 100*F in the summer and as low as 45-50*F in the winter. What oil does AMSOIL recommend in these applications [the Buell XB12Stt] and why?"

Amsoil "In your climate, I would use AMSOIL product code MVT, Synthetic V-Twin Transmission Fluid. It is thicker than is the Harley fluid, therefore will provide better protection in hot climates, yet work well in the cooler temperatures as well."

Me "What about engine oil?"

AMSOIL "In the engine use either 20W50 or SAE60 Motorcycle Oil, year around. The product codes are:

20W50 = MCV

SAE60 = MCS"

Me "Why not use the primary fluid? The Buell has a combined primary and transmission. I also noticed the Amsoil website recommends 20W50 in the primary. Thoughts?"

AMSOIL "The 20W50 can be used. I recommended the MVT due to the hot temperatures you will be encountering."

Gloomshadow
06-18-2015, 01:11 PM
gear oil is thick.. and has better shear .. that's why he is saying that. Im gonna get some.

GregoXB
06-18-2015, 01:34 PM
If you are gonna deal with 45F-50F temps you don't want any oil with 60 weight in your bike. You are much more likely to to do damage to your engine on a cold start with an oil that heavy. 20w50 is the right choice.

The first start of the day, a cold start, is the time when your engine is the most vulnerable. All the oil in your engine has settled to the bottom of the reservoir over night. You do not want 1000cc-1200cc worth of cylinder bouncing up and down for 2 minutes during warm up, waiting for a heavier oil to properly circulate. That's where premature engine wear will occur.

Gloomshadow
06-18-2015, 05:11 PM
who said anything about cold weather?? we are talking about 80-100F weather... . its like 90F across Florida today.. probably be up around 95F before the day is out.. when it gets down to 50 F or lower, that's COLD for us down here, most of us wont ride at temps that low.

Besides, Primary oil doesn't "circulate" . its just lubing a chain in a sump. You can run thick gear oil in that. There are no oil passages. Stick a belt drive on it and some carbon clutch disks, you can even run that Primary dry if you want to..

GregoXB
06-18-2015, 06:59 PM
"I'm in the Mojave Desert where ambient temps are around 100*F in the summer and as low as 45-50*F in the winter.

Gloomshadow
06-18-2015, 07:28 PM
20w-60HD could handle that... OR he could change his oil. no biggie

Risp
06-20-2015, 04:16 PM
I'll only be running the 20W60 in the summer months. Then back to 20W50 in the winter months. Spring and fall don't exist here in the Desert.

Risp
06-20-2015, 04:21 PM
I found Amsoil's nonchalant recommendation to run SAE60 year round to be interesting and contradictory to the manual and corporate knowledge.

Gloomshadow
06-20-2015, 04:41 PM
I saw a HD Sportster 1200 owner in the South say he did just that with no problem in a HD forum during my research. He said the key was to let the bike warm up for the first ride of the day if it was cold out. .. and if memory serves, our oil passages are bigger than a Sportster's. I bet in actual use you could probably get away with it if it didn't fall too far below 50F or so. Most guys don't want to ride when its cold out anyway.. unless they have to.