Firebolt error codes, TPS?

[firebolt99]

Hello all, I'm new to the forums. I have a 2008 Firebolt XB12R with an electronic jet kit and Jardine exhaust and I'm having some issues. For about a month the bike has been running rough when under hard acceleration, I had it tuned a few weeks ago and it ran better for a week and started getting worse again.

I was riding on the interstate the other day and the bike suddenly would not accelerate at all. When I would twist the throttle, the tach and speedometer needles would go up, but the bike would not accelerate. After coasting to a stop I put it in gear and the bike would not move forward at all, even with the clutch fully disengaged.

It is now sitting in my garage. I checked for error codes and I'm getting a code 11 (throttle position sensor) and code 16 (battery voltage). The bike starts and idles great, the tire will just barely spin when put in gear on a stand, but won't move the bike when it's on the ground. I have been told that I need to replace the TPS, which I have found for $60, but I don't want to start replacing parts without some advice from people with experience. Any help is much appreciated.

[Mope]

Tach increasing and bike not accelerating, bike in gear and doesn't engage......first thing I'm checking is the clutch.
Pop the primary inspection cover and smell for foul.

[Chicknstripn]

I second Mopes suggestion. Your issue could be as simple as a clutch adjustment.
I would also have the battery tested and look into the TPS.
I'm wondering if this "electronic jet kit" you speak of my be causing those codes. What exactly is it?
And who tuned your bike? What software did they use?
And just to get an idea of the type of wear you may or may not have on your clutch... ...how many miles are on it?
There are a lot of great minds on this forum. The more info you give the easier it is to give advice.
Good luck

[user_deleted]

what mope and jacob said. also.......

I have a 2008 Firebolt XB12R with an electronic jet kit
if you're referring to some sort of plug & play power commander unit i would get rid of it.


I was riding on the interstate the other day and the bike suddenly would not accelerate at all. When I would twist the throttle, the tach and speedometer needles would go up, but the bike would not accelerate.
clutch pack and cable adjustment required. test as follows: find a long steep hill, approach in 4th gear at 40mph, and briskly roll on throttle. bike goes nowhere and tach needle surges? faulty clutch plates and/or dramatically incorrect primary fluid.

[firebolt99]

Thanks everyone, I am going to check out the clutch when I get home from work tonight.

The bike was tuned at a local shop, the software used was dynojet winpep7.

The bike has 28,000 miles on it.

This is the electronic jet kit that is installed: http://www.electronicjetkit.com/Sportbike/viewproduct.asp?partnumber=9120309

[Mope]

I'm guessing that the 'tune up' you had adjusted your clutch/cable and remedied a sloppy adjustment or stretched cable. Like I said, I'd pop cover to check smell for burnt plates. If no issue there, I'd pull cover to see what type of movement is in your clutch cable when depressed/released.
At 28k, a new cable or clutch plates are definite possibilities. The xb clutch pack is solid, but they do burn quick when something goes wrong. Ask me how I know......

[firebolt99]

I went to pull the cover and managed to strip one of the torx head screws. Once I get it out I'll update when I check the clutch plates and cable.

[firebolt99]

I've removed the cover, the cable movement looks good but it smells a little funky in there. There are some metal shavings in the oil as well.

[user_deleted]

There are some metal shavings in the oil as well.
] if you'e referring to whiskers of metal on the drain plug magnet that is reasonable and quite normal. if you're referring to an aroma that can be described as either "brakes on fire mixed with oil".....or "electrical fire" i would closely check both your stator and your clutch plates while in there. sounds like clutch pack is shot.

[firebolt99]

if you're referring to an aroma that can be described as either "brakes on fire mixed with oil".....or "electrical fire"

That's pretty much what it smells like.

There was a fair amount of metal shavings floating around in there, more than I suspect there should be. Is there a certain tool I need to accurately measure the clutch plates, preferably one that isn't too pricey?

[Chicknstripn]

I found a set of digital calipers at radio shack for less than $25. That should do the trick.
Do you have the tool to compress the diaphragm spring? You can find it cheap on amazon. Least that's where I got mine.
You'll also need some quality snap ring pliers. Don't waste your money on some cheap "universal" units. Go for something heavy duty.
BTW I agree with lunatic and mope. Sounds like the clutch is fried.
Good luck

[firebolt99]

I found a set of digital calipers at radio shack for less than $25

Thanks, I just went and picked them up. Is the bike supposed to be in gear while I remove the clutch pack?

[Mope]

Do you have a manual? Early year manuals are available up top. I also have a 08 service manual .pdf so PM me if you're in need. The removal process is quite easy on the xb, but may take some extra time your first time. You'll need a locking tool but off the top of my head, I think that was the only specialty 'tool' (I, like most, just used some steel stock cut to length).

I can't remember what the plates cost when I had to do mine but I think H/D quoted me $55 if I just brought in the basket and new plates (basically, if you do 95% of the labor). Ended up that a buddy had access to the compression tool so I just did it myself.

You could see if any of the guys here have an extra basket - that's probably the cheapest option and we have a number of members that part/rebuild bikes.

[Chicknstripn]

Find a 3" brass door hinge. Has worked as a locking tool for my primary every time I've need to do any work that required removing/torquing any of the associated hardware.
Do yourself a favor and go to buellmods.com
And download a manual!

[firebolt99]

I have the manual and special compression tool but I cannot figure out how on earth to get out the snap ring and spring seat once I have the diaphragm spring compressed. The manual and every write up I have found do not go into specifics as to how I can remove these two pieces, can someone tell me specifically how to remove them? The manual says to remove the snap ring first but I can't because it won't compress with snap ring pliers due to the spring seat being inside of it.

[Mope]

Pictures always help - can't picture it; it's been awhile since I did one.

[UMDterp13]

Take a flat blade screw driver, find the end and pry that out. Work around it. If your even partly full of common sense you won't have any issue. It goes in just as easy. I just did this on a 09 last Friday.

Buell XB are stupid easy to work on. Main thing you'll need to know is the big lock nut holding clutch on is reverse thread so turn right to take off.
Before you get to the next question of what to use to get that off... an air/ impact gun for those is best but you can use other tools. 100-120psi should be plenty. Maybe Even more than enough.

[UMDterp13]

You should take primary cover off. This can't be done through the inspection hole lol

[Chicknstripn]

Sounds to me like you haven't compressed the diaphragm enough.
You should be able to access that snap ring fairly easily once you compress the clutch(diaphragm) spring.
Also, make sure you're using quality snap ring pliers. It makes a world of a difference having good snap ring pliers.
The manual states that you should only compress the spring as much as you need to. Well, I've had to almost bottom the dam thing out each time I've messed with it.
BTW If the retaining ring IS inside the snap ring (I too can't quite remember how it all goes together) then you need a set of snap ring pliers that will open up/stretch/expand the snap ring. That is probably your issue. I'll check the manual and confirm...

[Chicknstripn]

Forget that part about expanding the snap ring. I was way off on that.
While I was typing this I snooped around the internet and jogged my memory about that snap ring. You definitely need to compress the diaphragm spring some more. The snap ring that holds the retaining ring in place sits inside a groove that is machined into the clutch basket. Once you compress the diaphragm spring enough the retaining ring should fall out of the way and give you full access to compress the snap ring and remove it.

[firebolt99]

The clutch plates look fine and are the recommended thickness in the manual, I'm not exactly sure what else I'm looking for but I don't see any parts that are too worn or broken. What parts should I be taking a closer look at?

[Chicknstripn]

Check the clutch basket and Hub for any broken or missing parts.
Are you the original owner of the bike?
If not then check to make sure you have the right number of steel plates and friction plates inside the clutch basket.
Make sure the spring at the bottom or the clutch pack is facing the correct way. Or that it even exists. I'm familiar with an 07. So check with your service manual concerning the plates and their orientation.
Did your primary cover have any wear or cracks on it in the area where the clutch adjustment/actuation mechanism sits? I can't think of the actual name of the part but it's what the clutch cable connects to.
BTW you mentioned at the beginning of this post that you had a TPS code. Did you get that sorted out before you started taking things apart?
If your TPS isn't working properly you could have the throttle physically wide open but the ECM might be receiving a signal from the TPS that contradicts the throttle position. Hence limiting the amount of fuel/air actually going into the combustion camber. Then limiting power. It's a stretch, I know, but if nothing is wrong with the actual clutch mechanism I don't know what else to tell you.
Maybe someone with more knowledge then myself will chime in and have the right answers.
I hope I'm not confusing you or misleading you. I'm just giving suggestions based on my knowledge and experience.
Good luck

[firebolt99]

Thank you for your input. I'm the second owner, I bought it from a friend that I've rode regularly with since he got it, he had wrecked it before but had it all repaired and put 4000 miles on it after the wreck and it had no issues. I didn't see anything missing or broken in the clutch basket and hub, and the part that the clutch cable connects to looks fine as well. There are no cracks or wear in the primary cover or derby cover. Right now with the bike not running on a rear stand no matter what gear it is in the back tire will spin freely if pushed, sometimes making a type of grinding/squeaking noise as it spins. I haven't done anything with the tps yet because I wasn't sure if it had anything to do with the back tire freely spinning while in gear.

[Chicknstripn]

If you're absolutely positive everything inside the primary is sound then you'll have to split the cases to see what's going on inside the transmission.
If the engine started, idled and revved as it should, then there has to be something going on inside the transmission that is causing the engine power not to transfer to the rear wheel.
The rear pulley and countershaft(engine) sprocket are in good shape right? Have you pulled the engine sprocket to make sure the splines aren't stripped or something?
And you did inspect your drive belt? There aren't any teeth missing or anything that could cause it to slip?