Voltage Regulator or Stator?

[rcuppernall]

My 2008 xb12 is not holding a battery charge. I have already checked the battery and used another just to make sure and they both are drained when im done riding.

Here are the symptoms.
-shutting off when coming to or stoped
-battery drained after riding it for no longer the 15 min
-all of my lights are NOT dimming when i use the throttle.
-it coughs and sputters when i am stopped.
-check engine light is on. tested and is code 16

I have narrowed it down to either the Voltage Regulator or the Stator. i need some help because i do not want to put out the money to have it diagnosed.


Can i test these with a volt meter and is there a diagram or example somwhere to show me how?

[TPEHAK]

Have you fixed the problem? Did you check the voltage regulator output?

It looks like my 2009 Buell XB 12Scg has battery charging issue. Yesterday I was not able to start my motorcycle after one hour trip and battery voltage dropped to 11.8 volts, but before the trip it was fully charged. I checked the stator according 2008 Buell XB Electrical Diagnostic Manual manual and it is OK (0-0.1 ohms resistance between the plug 46 pins, there is no continuity between the plug 46 pins and motorcycle ground, the plug from the stator has 30 volts AC at 1200 RPM, 50 volts AC at 2000 RPM, 72 volts AC at 3000 RPM).

Then I connected the the stator to the voltage regulator and disconnected the voltage regulator from the plug 77. Then I started the motorcycle and measured DC voltage from the plug 77 from the voltage regulator side, and it shows 1.8 volts DC at any RPM. Does this mean that the voltage regulator is bad? The wires on the voltage regulator between the plug 46 and the plug 77 looks OK. The plug 46 look OK. The plug 77 look OK too.

When I connected all together and measured the DC voltage on the battery terminals it showed 12.9 volts DC at 1200 RPM, 14.25 volts DC at 2000 RPM, 14.27 volts DC at 3000 RPM, 14.28 volts DC at 3600 RPM.

[Cooter]

After 4 years I hope so! Haha.
11.8 volts is low (and could be a problem) but a no start? would it just not crank? just click? crank slow and not start?
Before the trip it was fully charged? how do you know?
How did you check the Stator exactly? did you OHM out each lead? or check the output while running?
I'm not sure what unplugging the '77' connector while running does. The way I understand it, the VR needs to be connected to the Stator AND the battery to operate.

All that aside, the simplest check for you to do is with the same voltmeter.

Attach it to the battery. Whats the voltage? (should be 12+ volts)
Crank it. How low does the voltage go? (should be more than 9.6 volts)
What is the Voltage at idle? (should be more than resting voltage)
What is the Voltage at 2500RPM? (should be 12.5-14.7 volts)

That will tell you if you need a battery, or if the charging system needs repair.

[TPEHAK]

Thanks for your help!

Yes it was fully charged. And I always know voltage on the battery when I park the motorcycle because I have Scorpio alarm system with telemetry. Here is the story. The motorcycle battery was on the charger before the trip (I always keep the battery on the charger because the motorcycle has extra accessories like Scorpio alarm system, m-lock and sometimes I use First Gear heated gear for cold days (but that day I did not turn on the heated gear), plus I use motogadget mini cluster with a bunch of relays instead of standard cluster, so they eat some amperes. I performed Milliampere Draw Test on parked motorcycle with attached m-lock and activated alarm system and it eats up to 10-18 milliamperes from the battery when motorcycle is resting. If I isolate the m-lock and the alarm system it eats 1.1 milliamperes with no accessories on the parked motorcycle. Does this mean a shortened wire in the accessories circuit or is it normal?

By the way, I washed my motorcycle with water before the trip, so maybe it can be a part of the reason? I've modified the tail section with tail light and the headlight is modified too so there can be some open wires and water can shorten them. I know that my new wiring has some water resistance issues, because if I ride under the rain my oil pressure check LED light can turn on and off for short time in half brightness like there is a connection between the oil pressure check wire and the motorcycle ground.

Yesterday after one hour trip I parked the motorcycle and according the Scorpio alarm telemetry the battery had 11.8 volts. Then I tried to start the motorcycle, but at 11.8 volts my m-lock relay just disconnecting the power from the battery while the starter was trying to crank the engine, so I shortened the m-lock relay contacts to eliminate the problem, but the motorcycle starter was not able to crank the engine and it was just clicking. So I roll the motorcycle to the gas station and asked a car driver to connect his car battery and started my bike. Then I rode 1 hour back to home and at home the battery showed 12 volts and I was able to start the bike with no jumping! Sounds like it was charging on the back way.

Today I tested the charging system. Before the test I fully charged the battery.

The 2009 Buell XB stator has 2 wires. I disconnected the plug 46 from the stator (under the left air scoop) and measured resistance between the plug 46 pins on the stator side, it showed 0 (zero) to 0.1 Ohm. Then I measured the resistance between the both plug 46 pins from the stator and the motorcycle ground and it was infinite (no continuity). I performed all these measurements with no motorcycle starting. Then I started the motorcycle with disconnected stator and measured the AC voltage on the the plug 46 from the stator, it showed 30 volts AC at idle 1200 RPM, 50 volts AC at 2000 RPM, 72 volts AC at 3000 RPM. So the stator is fine.

Next, I connected the stator back to the voltage regulator and disconnected the voltage regulator from the plug 77 under the right side air scoop. I connected the voltmeter to the plug 77 from the voltage regulator side and started the motorcycle. The voltmeter showed 1.8 volts DC at any RPM. I'm not sure this is the right way to test the voltage regulator.

Then I connected all this stuff back to initial condition (the stator connected to the voltage regulator and the voltage regulator connected to the motorcycle circuit), started the motorcycle engine and measured DC voltage on the battery terminals. It showed 12.9 volts DC at idle 1200 RPM (it is more than 12.7-12.6 volts while resting with no lights and the key switch is turned off, and it is more than 12.1-12.2 volts while resting with lights and the key switch is turned on), 14.25 volts DC at 2000 RPM, 14.27 volts DC at 3000 RPM, 14.28 volts DC at 3600 RPM.

When the battery is fully charged the voltmeter shows 12.7 volts DC on the battery with lights turned off at resting. When I turn on the key and the lights the DC voltage on the battery drops to 12.2 volts. When I start the fuel pump the DC voltage on the battery drops to 12.1 volts while fuel pump is pumping. When I crank the starter the voltage on the battery can drop below 7 volts for very short time if it is struggling with crank, or it can drops just to 10 volts for very short time if it is easy to crank, it is always different.

I inspected the wires and the plugs under the left side scoop and they are in good condition.
I use motogadget mini cluster and relays for the cluster lights, and LED turn signal flasher, they might eat some extra amperes comparing with the original equipment, or there can be a shortened wire in my new wiring? Should I perform Milliampere Draw Test? The bad thing is my digital voltmeter are not capable to perform this test with high amperes.

Is it bad battery? I bought the most expensive Duracell AGM battery just a year ago and I always keep the battery on the charger.

The weird thing is that it never happened before yesterday. It was like I rode the motorcycle with disconnected stator or with extra load on the battery like shortened wire. I believe even the battery is bad the charging system should keep the battery above the low voltage. Now I just can not trust the motorcycle to take it more than 1 hour away from home.

Maybe I will go to the the auto parts store next to me and ask them to perform the battery load test.

[Cooter]

I know it sucks to type a bunch, but THANK YOU for the details.

A 10-18mA draw is too much, 1.1 is OK. It sounds like you know why it draws. My guess is the Alarm system starter disconnect relay is wired incorrectly. It should only be active when the alarm is armed, the ignition circuit hot, AND the starter button is pressed. (#30 to starter, #87 to starter button and jumped to #85, #86 to alarm)

You're voltage dropping to 7 when it's cranking slow, tells me you need a battery.

It sounds like all of your charging system is OK.

[user_deleted]

with fully charged battery disconnect the negative cable. using a multi-meter set on DC AMPS connect one meter lead to end of negative cable and other lead to negative battery post. a constant current draw of more than approx. 1/2 amp means a problem and eventual dead battery. this test done of course with ignition OFF. start removing each blade fuse individually...then each relay. watch the meter for change. when it changes you've found the circuit with the excessive drain on the battery.

[TPEHAK]

with fully charged battery disconnect the negative cable. using a multi-meter set on DC AMPS connect one meter lead to end of negative cable and other lead to negative battery post. a constant current draw of more than approx. 1/2 amp means a problem and eventual dead battery. this test done of course with ignition OFF. start removing each blade fuse individually...then each relay. watch the meter for change. when it changes you've found the circuit with the excessive drain on the battery.

I performed this test yesterday, and it shows 10-18 mA with alarm system+mLock system. If I disconnect the alarm system it eats 7-10 mA. If I disconnect both alarm system and mLock system the motorcycle circuit with ignition off eats 1.1 mA. But even 10-18 mA is way smaller than 1/2 Amp (500 mA).

When my motorcycle is resting with ignition turned off and without charger it has no issues, it holds charge, It starts easy after weeks with no riding and with no battery on the charger. The issue is that something drained the battery very fast while I was riding, or the charging system was not working properly.

Today I checked the battery in a few different auto-parts stores and testers say the battery is good. So I am confused.

[user_deleted]

So I am confused.
see link below. buy one of these. it has 2 plain leads.
wire lead with white tracer to any switched positive source. i use orange headlight feed wire.
wire lead without white tracer to any ground. i use black headlight feed wire.
mount to flat pad atop left handlebar switchgear.
now ride. on low beam with no accessories operating it must read between 13.1 and 14.4 volts.
does it? nice
does it not? post back.
so simple.



http://www.ebay.com/itm/Waterproof-R...FWOvzD&vxp=mtr

[TPEHAK]

OK, it happened again, a couple days ago the battery voltage dropped to 12 volts after one hour morning commute, I even noticed the engine check light while riding for a moment, which means low voltage on the battery. Before the morning commute the battery was fully charged. But at the same day after returning home the battery had been fully charged after this one hour trip back home. And I did not wash the motorcycle before that day, and it was dry warm day.

I plugged heat gear that morning, but did not use it. And it was working OK with the heat gear another days. The heat gear has Radio Control module, is it possible that it can have a glitch and the receiver can eat amperes with no hitting the heat gear?

So I bought the voltmeter and soldered it in the Front 12V Auxiliary Power Outlet wires. On the 2009 Buell XB this outlet works only when engine run, but I believe it does not affect on the voltage reading.




I mounted the voltmeter to the bar clamp with double-side tape









And here is the results








Any suggestions?

[user_deleted]

with all the gadgets, trinkets, alarms, m-locks, radio control modules, heated gear and other assorted paraphernalia you've been mentioning who knows where the problem lies. as per the volt gauge i suggested your bike is charging within specs.