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Thread: Closed Loop Idle Question

  1. #1
    Since I remapped my ECM, I have been problems with cold idle, coughing, dying, I can hear more air being let in to try to bring the idle up, but apparently not enough fuel, so it has trouble. The RPMs also fluctuate between coughing at 800 and up to 1150. Idle is set at 1000.

    A search of related topics leads me to believe it's a closed loop idle problem. Several threads say to turn off closed loop idle. My question is why doesn't closed loop idle work? You'd think the bike would compensate but it just doesn't seem to want to work in this mode when it's cold.

    Is there any way to make it work properly in closed loop, or is the solution just to turn off closed loop idle? I really do like things to operate as they were intended.

    Thanks for your time.

  2. #2
    Senior Member mrlogix's Avatar
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    Since I remapped my ECM
    I really do like things to operate as they were intended.
    Just curious why your messing with the map then?

  3. #3
    Because I like things to operate as they were intended.

    Fuel+air+spark=Go

    ~fuel+2air(+/-)spark=not go

    I am absolutely certain that Erik Buell intended his machines to mix the right amount of fuel and the right amount of air with a spark to make them go. Not going (or at least not going very well) is not what Erik Buell intended.

    Are you really going to be that pedantic?

  4. #4
    Senior Member konarider94's Avatar
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    Give us the whole story.

    What did you change in the map? Will it or has it run at all since you changed the map(was it rideable)?

    I have 3 suspicions

    1. You flashed the whole eeprom of a race map from an incompatible version. Do not burn a different eeprom to your bike. Now its not even rideable. To fix reload your original eeprom that im hoping you saved and just upload the map (msq file) from the race eeprom. There are threads detailing how to do this. Also, I think with any eeprom flash you need to reset the TPS. Im not exactly sure what portion of the ecu that calibration is stored in. I hate even saying that because people say its a cure all.

    2. You put the new maps on the bike correctly and didnt reset the AFV to 100 and its causing it to be off at closed loop idle. Ride around for a while for the AFV to adjust after resetting it to 100. I doubt this would be enough for it not to run, but maybe. This does NOT require a tps reset. That wont be your problem if you did the maps correctly.

    3. You changed the actual map yourself and really messed things up.

  5. #5
    Konarider94, thanks for your time.

    None of your suspicions apply fortunately. I have been very careful following all the instructions of the very helpful users of this forum. When I got the bike, it was totally stock except for a K&N filter. I modified the muffler to where I wanted it before messing with the ECM because I knew I'd have to do it again. By the way, it's an 08 XB12XT.

    I got it hooked up to TunerPro RT and checked all the settings, and noticed that the AFV was at 73% which is well below recommended range. However, this could be expected because I live in Denver and the high altitude and less air naturally means less fuel. So I started by multiplying all the map values by .73, and then got everything worked out so I could monitor EGO Correction on datalogged rides, then adjusted the individual cells. Did about half a dozen datalogged rides, making adjustments every time and saving the files incrementally. The only place I had a problem was at WOT from 4000 to 4500 rpm where it seemed to want to run very lean even with the EGO Corr at 100, so I added fuel there until it felt right. During all this, the AFV was set to 100 and I eventually set WOT Enrichment to 100 so that I could get a clearer picture of what was going on. Once I was done with EGO Corr., I released AFV and set WOT Enrichment back to 110 so that everything would run normally.

    Long story short, when fully warmed up, the bike runs pretty well perfectly. But when it is cold at idle, running in closed loop, it just can't seem to get straightened out. As the engine bogs down, I can hear the idle air is increased but obviously sounds like it is running lean and so it tends to want to bog down more until it adds more fuel which then causes it to jump up to ~1200 rpms at which point it readjusts and drops back down and then the process repeats. Often it coughs and occasionally dies. All this goes away when it gets warmed up and idles perfectly at 1000 rpm.

    I did NOT put strange maps in my bike. I built my maps using the incremental steps as enumerated by users of this forum who have been very helpful.

  6. #6
    Senior Member mrlogix's Avatar
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    :)
    Are you really going to be that pedantic?
    not really, was just being scurrilous. If you would have posted the info that you replied to Kona to begin with it would have helped. :D

  7. #7
    Fair enough. I'd be happy to provide any and all information that could help me or someone with the same issue.

  8. #8
    Senior Member rchuff's Avatar
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    I would set your AFV at 120 and take it for a ride in learn mode witch is between 40&60 mph and no hard excels so the bike can learn.The AFV will come in on its own just give it time. what was your ego corr.at ?

  9. #9
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    Wondering if you matched the idle sections of your maps ?
    You will want the idle corner section of your map to have the same values...
    otherwise it will bounce between them and go lean-rich-lean-rich.

  10. #10
    Senior Member konarider94's Avatar
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    A wideband o2 would really help with this. I suspect you may have removed too much fuel from the idle. Has the afv changed much from 100 since your last change. Have you gone on a nice ride for it to adjust the afv? On the plus side you probably don't get much decel popping I'm guessing.



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