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Thread: DDFI-3 tuning with stock o2 sensor

  1. #11
    Senior Member AZmidget91's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcaff View Post
    Sounds great! I've been doing some research on that matter. LC-2 from Innovate is around 150 usd and it is the replacement for LC-1 which I think is fully supported by EcmSpy also. I would like something that I could install there and use it forever, replacing the stock one. Maybe this is the way to got for a proper tune.
    Yes, innovate is supported by ECMSpy, but the narrowband simulation doesn't work well with the stock ecm. From what I've heard plx works well with the ecm, and works with ECMSpy.

  2. #12
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZmidget91 View Post
    If that's all you have to go off of, then that will do.
    Why would he input data outside the realm of what the sensor is designed to read? Genuinely curious why this would be a good idea. I haven't seen the logs but I'd guess they are reading a rich condition and would have him lean out open loop. The cells were built around a target AFR from the factory.

    For the OP going wide band is obviously the way to go, tuning open loop with actual data instead of blind. Have a bung welded to the front header and report back what the spread is between fueling of front and rear for target AFR's, I think the "rule of thumb" being said is 20%.

    My worry is for every 1 person willing to install and tune with a wide band there are probably 30-50 unwilling to go that far, adjusting the values in open loop off of data from a narrow band sensor I don't think is a wise decision.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowkey View Post
    Why would he input data outside the realm of what the sensor is designed to read? Genuinely curious why this would be a good idea. I haven't seen the logs but I'd guess they are reading a rich condition and would have him lean out open loop. The cells were built around a target AFR from the factory.

    For the OP going wide band is obviously the way to go, tuning open loop with actual data instead of blind. Have a bung welded to the front header and report back what the spread is between fueling of front and rear for target AFR's, I think the "rule of thumb" being said is 20%.

    My worry is for every 1 person willing to install and tune with a wide band there are probably 30-50 unwilling to go that far, adjusting the values in open loop off of data from a narrow band sensor I don't think is a wise decision.
    Lowkey, 100% agree with you on that. Just one point, actually my datalogs say Im running lean in open loop. Megalogviewer usually wants to add fuel to the open loop cels of the map.

  4. #14
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    I decided to go for a wideband kit, just have to decide if LC2 or PLX. Read that both are very similar, I just want to make sure beforehand that the installation is straight forward as it seems to be, as Ill have it installed for good, replacing the stock sensor.

  5. #15
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcaff View Post
    Lowkey, 100% agree with you on that. Just one point, actually my datalogs say Im running lean in open loop. Megalogviewer usually wants to add fuel to the open loop cels of the map.
    Interesting! Would like to hear more on the how and why on this...

    Is it a consistent value across the cells or all over the place? By how much percentage would you say?

    Quote Originally Posted by mcaff View Post
    I decided to go for a wideband kit, just have to decide if LC2 or PLX. Read that both are very similar, I just want to make sure beforehand that the installation is straight forward as it seems to be, as Ill have it installed for good, replacing the stock sensor.
    Man, you'd be so close to doing it 100% right by getting a bung on the front and tuning both the front and the rear. Are you planning to just do rear, apply the 20% and call the front good or what?
    Last edited by lowkey; 02-17-2017 at 07:06 PM.

  6. #16
    Senior Member AZmidget91's Avatar
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    Like I've said, PLX is known to work with the ECM, which means you can leave it in forever. Innovate doesn't work well ebough with the ECM to be used as the narrow band once your tuning is done. Seems like an easy decision

  7. #17
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcaff View Post
    Lowkey, 100% agree with you on that. Just one point, actually my datalogs say Im running lean in open loop. Megalogviewer usually wants to add fuel to the open loop cels of the map.
    I searched and found the XB uses these sensors:

    Throttle Position (TP) Sensor
    Cam Position (CMP) Sensor
    Intake Air Temperature (IAT) Sensor
    Engine Temperature (ET) Sensor
    Oxygen (O2) Sensor
    Bank Angle Sensor (BAS)

    Without a knock sensor or wide band I cannot see how any data needed to add fuel in open loop can be achieved. Really curious how Megalogviewer comes up with these "add fuel" conclusions from the data provided in the logs.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowkey View Post
    I searched and found the XB uses these sensors:

    Throttle Position (TP) Sensor
    Cam Position (CMP) Sensor
    Intake Air Temperature (IAT) Sensor
    Engine Temperature (ET) Sensor
    Oxygen (O2) Sensor
    Bank Angle Sensor (BAS)

    Without a knock sensor or wide band I cannot see how any data needed to add fuel in open loop can be achieved. Really curious how Megalogviewer comes up with these "add fuel" conclusions from the data provided in the logs.
    Will get it for a logged ride right now! Thinking about logging with TunerPro this time. Will post printscreens when I come back

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZmidget91 View Post
    Like I've said, PLX is known to work with the ECM, which means you can leave it in forever. Innovate doesn't work well ebough with the ECM to be used as the narrow band once your tuning is done. Seems like an easy decision
    I am doing some research on this, could not find any complaint on the Innovate. Will go further on this before making the purchase

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowkey View Post
    Interesting! Would like to hear more on the how and why on this...

    Is it a consistent value across the cells or all over the place? By how much percentage would you say?



    Man, you'd be so close to doing it 100% right by getting a bung on the front and tuning both the front and the rear. Are you planning to just do rear, apply the 20% and call the front good or what?
    Really not sure how to do it. Dont feel confortable by just adding 20% blindly. If you analyze the stock maps you see this relationship doesnt hold. There are parts of the stock map in which rear cylinder is richer than fronts and other the contrary is true.

    Tought about tuning one cylinder at a time so that I'd need to buy only one WB kit. Is this a OK solution in your opinion?



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