Reply With QuoteLet's hope when you get that cps you can that bike back on the road. It's been a head breaker. But, you have a new fuel system that shouldn't be an issue going forward like cooter said.
Actually in a way I kind of did, it was either going to be fuel or timing so now that the fueling checks out time to get a CPS sensor. I was able to talk with a Harley tech over the phone yesterday and after I went through all that I had done/checked he agreed CPS is my next step. I'm waiting to hear back if he can order me one at a slight discount but he is in CA so I don't know if it will be worth it.Originally Posted by Cooter
Man, that sucks you didn't;t find it, but at least you can eliminate on more thing (says silver lining guy)
Let's hope when you get that cps you can that bike back on the road. It's been a head breaker. But, you have a new fuel system that shouldn't be an issue going forward like cooter said.
Thanks bud! Truly no hostility toward your last post, the efforts put in by those who have these type of problems never truly come through in a thread format I believe... in all honesty I should have had this figured out (everything I've gone through on it) in about 3 days or less but I wasn't as motivated as I could have been.
None taken. You won't forget this one. I was as stumped as the rest. ......but, I'm sure it would have cost more $ to just start replacing working parts with working parts :/
It's been a while since I updated this with progress/lack-there-of... ordered and installed a new CPS sensor and finally got the fuel line in from HD got that in there with some brand new NGK's I was waiting until I had the bike sorted out to install, absolutely no change what so ever....
Completely Pissed at it and bike week just started here in Laughlin so my dad said to take it to this company called "FAST", I guess they travel around to the bike events and do performance/dyno work on Harley stuff. We loaded it on a trailer and brought it over to them but the head guy didn't want anything to do with it (no surprise!), we were about to head out of the parking lot when two of the tech's were hanging out on the back side of the dyno rig and looking at my bike from afar an gave me the thumbs up. I decided since they showed interest and they were really slow since it was the first day they were there I'd just see if I could start it on the trailer and they could just throw out some ideas. One of them who was most interested in making some money for the day said at the least I should put it on the dyno for $65 and at least see what the AFR's looked like. The other tech (no older than 25) suggested to do intake seals again and if that didn't do it bring it back for the runs, by this time we wavered on just doing it now or at least get more eyes and ears on the bike to diagnose it so we got it off the trailer and over to the dyno while the enthusiastic tech talked with the dyno operator if he was willing to do it or not. All three of them looked over it while I pulled off the air scoops on both sides of the bike as we started it and tried to get it to idle about 10 times. I told them all the things I had already done/checked/swapped/tried. They had no software for the bike and that was the big thing I guess in why they didn't want to touch it but I told them I have software/laptop I could bring and that they could see anything they wanted and that I didn't care if they used my laptop to do whatever they needed. I don't know if the one tech had even spayed the intake seals yet but that is what we were attempting to try when the bike actually started to idle OK for 15 or so seconds, at this point I had 3 techs I wasn't even paying looking and talking with so I didn't want them to get in trouble with the boss so we all agreed I would take it home and do intake seals (which I already had bought off their boss who didn't want to touch the bike) which was my next move anyway. I was shocked to see the James blue gaskets I had put in about 4 or 5K ago turned from soft blue big gaskets to black rock hard and shrunken gaskets, the front showed a perfect seal while the rear one looks like it was pinched in the flange, at last I thought... this one must have blown a huge air leak so big I couldn't even seal it with spray to diagnose it! Now motivated I had found the problem, I put in the Cometic seals that look identical to the stock Harley ones, although these are really soft but much smaller sealing surface than the James blue ones are. I got the bike back together then next morning only to find... the exact same no idle running condition! Absolutely no change whatsoever!!!!
Now we have rigged up a proper propane setup that I have yet to test the seals with. I need some time away from the bike as it is frustrating me to no end... I will update with my findings.
I'm not sure if I've missed this but what year is the bike?
If it's 08 or newer your issue could be your idle air control valve.
If it's an older bike it could be the TPS sensor itself.
Does it show signs of life and adjust properly via ECMspy or whatever software you have?
Again, if some of this has been cover before it might be a good idea to list all the things that you have done.
You don't have to go into detail just give us a quick check list so we can see where you're at.... ....well where you're at other than one step closer to lighting your bike on fire!
2007 XB12STT with 18,450 miles
- 0 miles on Cometic intake seals
- 0 miles on NGK dcpr9eix plugs
- 0 miles on CPS sensor
- 2.5-3K miles on bosh O2 sensor
- fuel pump flows 2.4oz of fuel after 2 pump primes at 5 seconds = 13.5GPH
- kill switch on pump priming 51psi
- regulator steady hold of 49psi
- visual inspection of injectors spray pattern/functioning in perfect condition
- Coil and wires tested within spec of manual
- TPS properly set/working fine as well as all other sensors working as can be seen in the various ECMSpy windows in the video in my first post...
- Tank wide open for over a week to dry completely out with pump out/cap off and now sitting with a second tank of fresh gas since issues.
- All basic **** we would be telling noobs like grounds/wiring harness/plug connections/wiggle test was the first thing done.
-TunerProRt/ECMSpy/ECMDroid
Tested with BAS/02/AFV/EGO/idle closed loop/open loop learn/idle timing adjust all off (all sensors that can be turned off and still run) with no change.
Bike is fixed!!!
Ended up being a corrupt EEPROM file. When this all first happened one of the first things I did was re-flash the EEPROM multiple times with known good ones I had saved but what was happening on ECMSpy is on the EEPROM tab there is a check box for flashing the whole EEPROM over or just the changes made, that box had been checked so there was corrupt data somewhere. I unchecked it and flashed the old saved file from when I first bought the bike back in 2012 that I had previously been trying, once I fired it up it ran as if it never had an issue! Also of note with a bluetooth adapter you have to watch the bottom of the ECMSpy window whenever you are flashing or retrieving from the ECU as I noticed it only burned a page or two the first attempt and didn't give me the "toggle key to finish", which I think is key to knowing if a flash takes effect or not. This "could" have happened to me causing my issue or I messed up a value somehow, I'm still not sure where the error was only that it works now.
One other neat trick I came up with before the ECU fix was I wanted to be sure the intake seals were properly seated so I borrowed an endoscope camera from my dad and stuck it in through the throttle body and spun it around on the seam between manifold and head, this worked out perfect for inspection! I'll be doing this anytime I change the seals while the engine is still rotated so I can be sure they are perfect without reinstalling the engine just to fire it up and find out.
Well I have one other piece of gold to share about the CPS sensor and a replacement for less than a 3rd of the price of one from HD but I will wait on that until I can put some miles on the bike with this new one to make sure all is well first.
NOT being confrontational...........NOT being argumentative.............NOT being hyper-critical.....NOT looking for any sort of response or keyboard rumble.
having said that i have never understood nor ever will understand this constant fiddling with ecm units. and NO...i am NOT inferring that is what you were doing that initiated this 2 month saga. but this thread commenced with eeprom accessing as well as data-logging and chronicled your frustration and broken XB. none of this was coincidental.
i'm one of the board elder statesmen and 2017 tech-challenged so most of this ecm jibberish is greek to me. commence with the bashing as inevitably it's forthcoming.
Lunatic, come on now... step up to the plate a take your shot! I'm standing over here sheepishly willing to take em.
Totally agree with you, even if it was a failed "burn" that caused all my issues, it was my fault for communicating with the ECU in the first place. Keep in mind though we suggest using these very tools for simple tasks like reseting TPS and AFV, a failed communication could result in a similar situation. I was a computer programmer by trade for 12 years, it's in my nature to tune, I think I've done an admirable job holding out this long considering I've had the bike since 2012. Also the PO had changed the maps so I don't even have a stock "base map". You would be surprised what tuning can do for a vehicles behavior not just a search for power. If it wasn't for pushing ECU tuning there is no way I would have been able to double the power out of our little supercharged grocery getter Honda reliably.
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