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Thread: Buell XB12R battery losing charge

  1. #1

    Buell XB12R battery losing charge

    I have an 07 Buell Firebolt XB12R, completely stock. I have been having problems with the battery holding a charge. Based on some conversations with some people I decided to replace the VR (1st time) and battery, yet again (3 in about a year). I installed a new Voltage Regulator from HD with the updated connector yesterday as well as a brand new battery today (tested good before I bought it). With a multimeter on the battery the voltage when running is around 13.85-14.25. Once I turn the bike off it quickly drops down for about a minute to around 13.00. After that it drops about .01 per 15 minutes or so. I'm not sure how far it will drop but I should have a better idea tomorrow. Despite the new items the bike is doing the same thing as before. I talked to EBR in WI and Dan told me to check the wiring harness in the left side of the bike. I have checked all fuses, J fuse, three relays under the handlebars, etc. I have yet to test the wiring harness(es) because I am not quite up to speed on the wiring or how to do the tests. I disconnected to Neg from the battery, touched red to the wire, black to the terminal, and the reading was .01

    Before I tear the bike down further than I need to has anyone experiences this or something similar?

    Also can someone with more knowledge than I possess briefly talk me through what wires should be checked, or point me to which test I should focus on out of the service manual. While the wiring diagram in the service manual is helpful, its only to those with some experience in wiring. I apologize if this has been addressed in a previous post, but I haven't found that post yet.

  2. #2
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    It looks like time for this mod

    http://www.buellxb.com/forum/showthr...ontrol-housing

    My battery voltage with running engine shows 14.2 v. When engine stops it shows 12.2-12.3 v if fan is not working and light is ON. After a day it can show 12.1-12.0 v with light ON. After a week it can show 12.0-11.9 v with light ON, but it does not drop lower, even it has armed alarm system and keyfob sensor which takes some energy, and it has no issues with engine cranking even after a week. So if it stays above 12.0 v with light ON it is probably OK.

    If it drops below 11.9 v with light ON in a short period of time you can find the leakage using multimeter, service manual wiring diagram and youtube guides, no need to tear apart motorcycle, just play unplugging fuses and different electrical units until you will have find the circuit with excessive draw with bad unit or stripped wires or something else.

    Last edited by TPEHAK; 06-23-2017 at 06:01 AM.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Theres a lot of info in your post. I appreciate that. But you're missing some vital info.
    "Having problems with the battery holding a charge" Like it won't crank after you stop at the bar? the next day? several months later? It starts, but hesitates on the first turn over?
    Is it on one of those (horrible) battery maintainers that everyone thinks is a charger (it's not)?

    3 batteries in a year?? holy shmoly...why?? are they testing bad after a few months, or just swapping them, guessing?
    Replaced the VR? WHY? did it test bad?

    If you did the amp draw test as you described and only show .01A, then there isn't a draw significant enough to worry about.
    If it's charging about 14.7V at 2500+rpm thats good.
    Resting voltage above 12V, thats good.

    With all the tests showing good, why mess with the wiring?

  4. #4
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    your situation not unique. at least 1 post similar to yours pops up on here weekly. let's divide your situation into 3 distinct areas and address each one as follows:
    1-the battery
    2-the charging system
    3-the bikes' electrical circuits
    item #1----three batteries in 1 year is laughable. i'll assume you have a top quality fresh battery that is fully charged and has passed a "load-test" with flying colors. if so #1 has just been solved.
    item #2----an XB charging system is simple. alternator contained inside front section of primary cover that feeds AC current to your VR which removes the sine wave converting same to DC current which charges your battery and runs your bikes electrical circuits. it's just like a car. using a multi-meter set it to DC volts....pin the 2 legs to your battery and start the bike. the readings you mentioned in your post are spot on. your bike is 10 plus years old. as these alternators/stators age their output subtly drops at idle speeds. general rule for your age of bike is that if you see 12.0 volts at 1100rpm.....and 13.2-14.7 volts@3000rpm all is well.
    item #3-you probably spoke to danny hurda @ ebr when you called. what he was suggesting you test for is both a charging system wiring harness "break" that a volt meter attached to battery on running bike would reveal.....OR...a short in the main wiring harness that is grounding out a component and causing a substantial parasitic loss with bike off. that's fine but here's what i suspect: a substantial parasitic loss. when it happens and draws down your battery....particularly down to the point that the battery is "dead"....that battery is never the same after that event. follow TEABAG'S vid which is great....find that parasitic draw....and you'll resolve this problem quickly. and DON'T FORGET: on a buell you ALSO perform this test by removing each relay 1 at a time. and i'll bet that during this test the moment you remove the BATTERY FUSE you've just found the guilty culprit.
    Last edited by user_deleted; 06-23-2017 at 01:53 PM.

  5. #5
    Cooter,

    Thanks for your response; I will try to elaborate on some of the things that you noted.

    Having problems holding a charge. I put the bike on a trickle charger for 12-24 hours, after which the battery reads around 14.3 volts. Once I take it off it will hold enough charge to start it the next day, but it will lick for a few seconds before starting. When I test the battery using a multimeter at that time the voltage is down to around a broad range of 7-10 volts depending on how long it has been since I removed the charger, but within 24-48 hours.

    The first two batteries tested bad when I had them checked at both AutoZone and Advanced Auto. I went to three different shops and had the battery tested and all came up with replace battery.

    Here are the results of each test.
    V - 12.73, 12.76, and 12.81
    Measured - 210 CCA, 207 CCA, and 206 CCA
    The temps measured were, 74 degrees, 69, and 72.

    The new battery that I bought was tested before I purchased it and the readings were,
    V - 12.73
    Measured - 254 CCA
    74 degrees.
    Tested as a good battery.

    I replaced the VR after viewing a guys post with pics where he showed a pic of his VR with a blown neg post if I remember correctly. On the backside of the VR there was a small bubble on one of the connectors, neg I believe. The only wire with a yellow sleeve on the connector under the rubber type material. I compared his pic with mine and the bubble showed it was in the exact same location. I tested each wire albeit after the fact for the continuity of each wire and they all had continuity. Maybe I wasted $150 on a new VR when I didn't need to, maybe not. I say this because the proper operation of a multimeter is frankly some magical wizardry that I am unfamiliar with. The VR was purchased through Lancaster HD in PA, and was brand new.

    With the old battery it was charging at 14.4 or so at 2800-3000 RPMs. The new one is about the same. When I shut off the motorcycle, with each battery there is a significant drop in voltage rapidly down to around 12.5 to 12.0 depending on how long I monitor it. The old battery would be down to 7-10 by the next morning while the new maintains around 13.5-13.10, so I feel that the old battery might have been contributing to the issue.

    I agree that after the amp draw test there is no reason for concern. This is the first time that I have started to track the battery readings over an extended period of time as the first battery I chalked up to winter, intermittent riding/starting, etc. so I replaced it.

    I started to mess with the wiring because I thought that it wasn't possible for me to have two bad batteries in a row and after reading countless posts that were similar to mine, I moved on to what might be a contributing issue, wiring and VR. I don't believe the stator to be an issue because it seems to charge while the bike is running.

    The second battery lasted around 6-8 months with regular riding and charging with a maintainer when not riding, but still went bad. I say bad because after a few months the issue arose again where the bike clicked a lot when starting, if it started at all. Now I am on the 3rd battery.

    Some of what I have checked for wiring includes brake lights, blinkers, headlights, all of the more common fuses that I know of (fuse box, J-fuse, and a couple others I believe) and soon to be ignition and side stand. I have inspected all of the visible wiring harness for fraying, signs of deterioration, and obvious signs of damage. I understand that I am now chasing down the rabbit hole with no end in sight.

    So after the thesis for which I apologize, historically the issue seems resolved for about 6 months, only to return with the battery and starting issues.

    Thanks for the assistance.

  6. #6
    Lunaticfringe,

    I have only had one of the new batteries tested before purchasing, my fault as I assumed all batteries should be good when buying them. They are not because prior to purchasing one of them this week, it tested bad at the store. I declined that battery and shopped elsewhere for a battery. I now know to have them tested before walking out of the shop.

    I charged the new battery for about 15 hours on a trickle charger prior to installing it.

    After reading your post I believe that point 1 and 2 are not a factor at this point.

    To address the the 3rd point, which I think might be the issue;

    I have to watch the video and follow TPEHAK's post to see if I can identify anything.

    Thanks to everyone for their assistance.

  7. #7
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    ^^^^ you're welcome.
    simply put you have an intermittent parasitic draw that no "battery maintainer/tender" will resolve or overcome.
    it's either the VR causing it....or a "short to ground" in the 77 connector harness behind the front pulley cover.
    other than a failing ecm which is extremely unlikely....nothing else can cause your situation.
    you need to remove the front plastic pulley cover....3 torx screws....and CAREFULLY inspect every single wire and connector in that area. a problem within the notorious #77 connector can cause exactly the problem you're experiencing.
    see my first comment to you and the BATTERY FUSE! this is the VR test.
    Last edited by user_deleted; 06-24-2017 at 02:50 PM.

  8. #8
    With a new VR that I assume is good, then it goes to the wiring of the VR, or the 77 connector as you stated. When I installed the new VR I changed from the oval type connector to the new square shaped connector on the bike end.

    Per the instructions, they state to cut all four wires, attach new connectors, etc.

    I cut the two wires from the 77 connector, attached the new connectors and plugged the VR into the bike end connector. Do these two wire positions matter when inserting them into the new connector? I assume that they do because after following them on the wiring diagram they go to different places. I followed the same pattern from the old connector because they are both black wires. The bike didn't blow up afterwards so I assume that either it doesn't matter or I got them right.

    The other connector from the VR I didn't change as they matched already. I did an inspection of those wires and connector for corrosion, debris, etc. and it seemed fine.

    After reattaching the VR, I believe that the issue is resolved. I want to run through various tests one more time to ensure that there is no additional draw, and that the bike gets to or close to 14v when running, and does not drop below 12v when resting. Maybe I have just had bad luck with batteries and the new VR and connectors and a new and tested battery has corrected the issue. Other than that, I think that I am good.

    Again, thank you for the assistance.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Every test you have quoted except one passes within spec. The battery dropping rapidly to 12.5V is ok. 7-10V the next morning is NOT ok.
    I agree the charging system is good (at least when you test it).
    I agree with Lunatic there could be an intermittent draw.

    But your comment about clicking while starting has me thinking a weak starter solenoid could be the culprit. Even with a battery that tests good, if the solenoid won't hold contact that exact symptom will happen. I'm not one for swapping parts without testing but they are cheap.

  10. #10
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    Charging system probably was good when you were measuring the voltage. But there is a possible situation when you have loose connection somewhere in alternator circuit, or bad voltage regulator, or broken wire, and after some time it stops charging, or charges inconsistently. I had this issue and that is why you need to install voltmeter on the motorcycle to constantly monitor the voltage to make sure it works appropriately all the time.



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