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Thread: New guy, need help troubleshooting no start.

  1. #1
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    New guy, need help troubleshooting no start.

    Hi all,

    Been lurking on here for years, this Summer presented me with the opportunity to finally purchase my dream bike. 2008 XB12ss in Valencia Orange, one previous owner since new left it absolutely bone stock, just over 10,000 miles on the clock now. I purchased the bike this and rode it home, 1350 miles over 2 days. Spent a few weeks riding to and from work then another long 375 mile trip to meet with my wife. Just as I was within a mile or two of meeting her, the bike started to run horrible, stuttering bad at low revs and idling rough. Loaded the bike and drove back home. Now it won't start at all. I know how important details are so I will list what I can think of below.

    2008 XB12ss
    K&N filter
    Stock muffler
    Grounding mods completed nose to tail
    Replaced plugs with NGK Iridium 400 miles ago
    Replaced plug wires with new suspecting bad wire
    No code being indicated by check engine light
    Fuel pump primes during pre-start
    During attempts to start I've had a couple after-fires out the exhaust and a single back-fire out the intake (Yes Lunatic, I've been paying attention)
    Mostly it just cranks with little signs of firing

    I am going to double check for trouble codes using the jumper/test wire and would appreciate any suggestions for what else to check.

    Depending on what you guys suggest my next suspects are as follows:

    Check coil for proper resistance
    Check cam position sensor for movement or any wiring problems

    Really hoping to get this running again since my riding window for this year is closing fast.

    Thanks in advance for any advice.

    Ted

  2. #2
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    ted: well done on your nomenclature regarding flying fire-balls during cold start procedure. i salute you Sire!
    1-see link below for simple fault code retrieval.
    2-the flying fire-balls is always 100% ignition related. can be fouled plugs....coil plug wire from main harness shorted to ground....loss of ECM ground.
    3-to confirm #2 simply remove front spark plug as it's the easiest to access. blackened and fuel soaked? loss of spark!
    4-humor me if you haven't done this check already: remove fuse box lid and check IGNITION FUSE. remove.....check it....clean terminals it plugs into....reinstall. and while you're in there carefully check KEY SWITCH relay. how??? key off...kill switch to ON...fuse box lid removed...now turn key to on while listening closely to fuse box area and placing a finger on the KEY SWITCH relay. you should hear it "click" AND feel it "click". it's subtle but you can tell.
    BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING ELSE check that plug AND examine the bike to confirm that you have a clutch lever safety interlock switch AND a side-stand safety interlock switch. most do....some don't. they are simple Nissin "button-style" circuit interrupter type switches. rule them out as the culprit. how???? simply remove the 2 wires from each....place pins of multi-meter on terminals and set meter to OHMS....and work the switch. if healthy should see meter go from infinite ohms to 0 ohmrs.
    the above is where i'd start.

    https://www.buellxb.com/forum/showth...ouble-Codes-08
    Last edited by user_deleted; 09-28-2018 at 11:16 AM.

  3. #3
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    Thanks Lunatic, I forgot to mention that I already checked ECM connectors, battery terminals and fuse conditions. I will actually pull the ignition fuse, clean and check connections but the box was clean and dry, I will also check the relay while I'm in there. Then my plugs and report back.

    As for the switches, definitely no side stand switch. Would the clutch switch be on the lever?

  4. #4
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Ya the clutch switch is 2 wires on the lever, but that would affect cranking, not ignition.

    The clues of 'running well and just started to run poorly, then no start' I would guess its the CPS. Fairly inexpensive part and easy to swap, so worth a shot-in-the-dark guess.

    Next guess would be fuel pressure or chaffed wires at the pump inside the tank. Also easy to check:
    Hang the rear of the bike, remove lower shock bolt, hang swingarm, drain tank, remove pump. Might as well put in a new fuel filter while its out.

    Have you tried opening the throttle while cranking? It will add air. Extended cranking will foul the plugs for sure. The DDFI-3 ECM's like your bike has, have a plug cleaning procedure (in the manual) as well (Lunatic taught me that)

  5. #5
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    Hey Cooter, I did try various throttle inputs while cranking, no noticeable change there. If I have to dig as deep as removing the fuel pump I will definitely be replacing the filter while I’m there. I’ll look for the plug cleaning procedure, any hints to what chapter and verse these wise words would be located?

    Is there a way to confirm correct fuel pressure and regulator operation without the fancy connectors I see in the service manual?

  6. #6
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    I don't know the location, it's easy though. Try searching on here. Maybe Lunatic will chime in with the procedure again?

    Sorry, fancy connectors needed. Fuel pump removal is easy. I can have one out in 10 mins and I'm dumb with large hands and 10 thumbs

  7. #7
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    Squirt a shot of starting fluid down the throat of the beast (with the throttle open) and try to start it. If it likes that, you likely have a fuel issue. If not, its likely ignition.


    It think lowkey and (the one who shall not be mentioned) struggled with finding the correct fittings to read fuel pressure.

  8. #8
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    Okay, update time.

    - Checked fault codes, none showing.
    - Checked Ignition fuse and key switch relay, clean & dry with good contacts.
    - Replaced plug wires with new factory.
    - Checked front plug, it was blackened and wet looking so I checked spark, good spark on both front and rear plugs.
    - Checked wiring best I could in the short time I've had, but Ill have another look with more time and better lighting.
    - Fuel pump is working as advertised.

    So I am getting spark and air, the only thing left I can think of is a blocked injector, fuel filter or fuel pressure regulator. I'm hesitant to try a squirt of starting fluid down the throat, just seems like asking for trouble.

    Alternatively, is it possible to have a bad crankshaft position sensor sending timing off without getting a trouble code?

  9. #9
    Senior Member Chicknstripn's Avatar
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    www.buellmods.com for a service manual.
    Since your bike is an 08 I would suspect an issue with your idle air control valve(IAC).
    Google cleaning procedures for IAC
    Also, I would start with fresh( properly gapped) plugs and refrain from twisting the throttle while trying to start the bike. Buell’s foil plugs very easily if throttle is twisted/blipped on start up or on a cold engine.

    Can you recall anything out of the ordinary prior to the bike crapping out on you? Seems odd the bike ran so well for so many miles then gave up.

    Your battery, and all connections related to said battery are good?

    Good job trouble shooting so far.
    Don’t lose faith, you’ll figure out this issue soon...

  10. #10
    Senior Member Silverrider's Avatar
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    When you bought the bike has it been sitting for a while ?? As 3419 said spray a little gas in the TB and see if it wants to run , It could be clogged tea bag on you pump filter as it was on a 08 I had. ( could I use the word Tea bag ?)

    As Cooter said fuel pump is my guess. Spray gas test will answer that !

    pump3.JPG


    Last edited by Silverrider; 10-02-2018 at 11:08 PM.

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