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Thread: Any last ideas before I dive into the world of custom tunes?

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by yugo42 View Post
    Cossack84, I forgot to mention that mine is an '04 as well! Did you do a static timing adjustment before settling on those timing table values? Did you install a second bung or get a different header to monitor both cylinders?

    I can't wait to get this thing sorted out. It's a blast to get on the throttle but that cruising/low-speed stumble really sucks the fun out of riding it, especially going around corners.
    I did not check the static timing which I probably should. I installed a second bung in stock header. And you are right about the dang stumble, its is very annoying and some times could be a safety concern. You keep pulling a throttle and nothing happens then whole of a sudden, bam you going wide open, or at least it feels like it.
    I'll try to keep up with this post as I go a long. I changed my fuel table after last ride but hadn't had a chance to go back out yet. Kinda waiting on warmer weather so its more representative of my average riding.
    Let me know if you need help with anything. It sucked learning all of this on my own.

  2. #12
    mosquito can you also post your acceleration enrichment tables?

  3. #13
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    fuel map

    IMG_8022.jpg Here's the map which I use on both front and rear cylinders. Good luck, the effort will pay off! Tuning my XB transformed it from a farting, bucking annoying lump of ****e to the awesome Hot Rod it is. It idles now and pulls clean and hard from idle to red line and sounds awesome on the overrun with nary a pop...very satisfying!

  4. #14
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    If you are going to go through the effort of wide band tuning, weld in 2 more bungs, one in the 2010 XB front header location and one that clears the RSS. Take a single wire narrow band sensor and cut off the connector and wire it up to your WB signal wire, this way you can swap the input to the ECM between the stock location NB sensor that stays installed in the header or your WB in either the front or rear second location whenever you want to datalog. I bought Vibrant Performance bungs with a curved lip to weld onto the header (you will need to reshape them to a tighter radius), I also ported out the header after the bungs were welded in with a porting long shaft rasp.

    You must lock the ECM from making adjustments or datalogging will be pointless. You will also want to have a controlled route and try to keep the ambient temperatures the same for each datalog ride to get meaningful results. Flush out the portions of the datalog where were fuel enrichment is added (warmup enrichment and temp threshold). It is also imperative that you properly setup MegalogViewer to the WB you choose to use, the Voltage to AFR reading is what I'm talking about and if you don't do this MegalogViewer will be adjusting to the wrong AFR's (this is true for all software you may choose to tune with.) You can even go so far as to hang the WB O2 sensor in the air for a true lean reading and feed it in propane for true rich. I used this free software to graph out a linear line for voltage and the correlating AFR reading https://graph.soft112.com.

    One last thing is all this is pointless to do if the bike isn't in absolutely perfect operating condition.

    20180402_153150.jpg
    20180210_163101.jpg

    Using this guide will help anyone to understand how to tune the bike, even if you don't choose to use ECMSpy to do the tuning. http://www.ecmspy.com/ug_mono/V2.0/userguide_mono.shtml

  5. #15
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mosquito View Post
    If you have a 12 you can use the 0 and 8000 column somewhere useful in the working RPM range, you could rescale the TPS rows and RPM columns as well.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowkey View Post
    all this is pointless to do if the bike isn't in absolutely perfect operating condition.
    X Eleventymillion And then double check it, and then check it again.

    Hey lowkey, what do you mean about wiring in a NB sensor to the WB O2 signal wire? You aren't using a NB emulator on the existing WB? Is this a way around it? I don't want my header to look like a porcupine but thats awfully creative

  7. #17
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    Nothing as cool as that sounds. I just cut off the connector that a stock NB has and wired it to the WB harness signal wire so I can hot swap the signal wire feeding the ECM that sits close to the rear rocker box between the stock rear NB and enable the ECM to use it OR feed WB signal to the ECM for datalogging (ECM adjustment disabled). I can do this swap in a couple minutes by removing the air box outer cover and reaching in next to the rear rocker cover. On the header side I just thread in the WB to the cylinder I want to log and tune. The wiring harness I made for the whole WB setup is completely plug-n-play for any XB which is pretty cool! I'll have to get the setup out of the box and get some pictures soon as it's currently removed right now.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by mosquito View Post
    IMG_8022.jpg Here's the map which I use on both front and rear cylinders. Good luck, the effort will pay off! Tuning my XB transformed it from a farting, bucking annoying lump of ****e to the awesome Hot Rod it is. It idles now and pulls clean and hard from idle to red line and sounds awesome on the overrun with nary a pop...very satisfying!
    Thanks for the fuel map, but do you have access to acceleration enrichment tables as well?
    Here is a quote from EcmSpy tinning guide: "Acceleration Enrichment is applied when the throttle is opened fast to richen the mixture and prevent the bike from hesitating whilst giving a fast ans smooth transition between steady state operating points. "

    In TunerPro data in my tables looks like this and I'm thinking could be another thing that needs attention.



    which is very different from the tuning guide. Thats why I was wondering if you had a table you could post up, or maybe lowkey could chime in with his.

    Last edited by cossack84; 03-12-2019 at 11:43 AM.

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by lowkey View Post
    If you are going to go through the effort of wide band tuning, weld in 2 more bungs, one in the 2010 XB front header location and one that clears the RSS. Take a single wire narrow band sensor and cut off the connector and wire it up to your WB signal wire, this way you can swap the input to the ECM between the stock location NB sensor that stays installed in the header or your WB in either the front or rear second location whenever you want to datalog. I bought Vibrant Performance bungs with a curved lip to weld onto the header (you will need to reshape them to a tighter radius), I also ported out the header after the bungs were welded in with a porting long shaft rasp.

    You must lock the ECM from making adjustments or datalogging will be pointless. You will also want to have a controlled route and try to keep the ambient temperatures the same for each datalog ride to get meaningful results. Flush out the portions of the datalog where were fuel enrichment is added (warmup enrichment and temp threshold). It is also imperative that you properly setup MegalogViewer to the WB you choose to use, the Voltage to AFR reading is what I'm talking about and if you don't do this MegalogViewer will be adjusting to the wrong AFR's (this is true for all software you may choose to tune with.) You can even go so far as to hang the WB O2 sensor in the air for a true lean reading and feed it in propane for true rich. I used this free software to graph out a linear line for voltage and the correlating AFR reading https://graph.soft112.com.

    One last thing is all this is pointless to do if the bike isn't in absolutely perfect operating condition.

    20180402_153150.jpg
    20180210_163101.jpg

    Using this guide will help anyone to understand how to tune the bike, even if you don't choose to use ECMSpy to do the tuning. http://www.ecmspy.com/ug_mono/V2.0/userguide_mono.shtml
    lowkey I did exact same thing as you suggesting. Just keep swapping stock NB signal wire going to ecm with WB 0 to 5 v output signal. I appreciate all the suggestions and info. It took me some time to get the MegalogViewer to show proper data because of what you described. (hint to new guys be careful of some vendors giving out their suggestions/recommendations on how to set that part up, very unprofessional in my opinion).
    Would you care to post your timing table along with acceleration enrichment just for a reference point?
    Last edited by cossack84; 03-12-2019 at 12:40 PM.

  10. #20
    Senior Member lowkey's Avatar
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    Crosshack84 sure, I'll have to do it in a day or two when I can boot into windows and pull the data. It takes a lot of rides to dial in the maps because of flushing out the useless data from the logs, it ended up getting to hot in AZ and I got my fuel maps 80%-90% dialed in when I stopped last season. The first thing I do is get my columns and rows set up for maximum usability in part throttle and a nice spread of RPM below 4K. NEXT I get the bike up to temp for zero enrichment then dial in the live 4 cells on each map separately to 14.7AFR. I then never let software such as megalog touch them when optimizing the fuel maps. I run an old version and choose to work on a tight RPM range and TPS input at a time to filter out data influencing a change outside this area. Using TunerProRT I set up deceleration fuel cut to like 90% from 7K to 2.5K then ramping out to idle (sorry all from memory RN) I have a D&D that doesn't pop on decel like this, also engine braking is extremely strong! There is a ton of tables and data to manipulate in TunerProRT if you don't load the "lite" version of your ECM. I was working on graphing in the WB signal data to be used in it's datalog analysis side so it would populate an adjusted fuel table but didn't finish and just used megalog as it already did the job OK. I was nervous of running without the ECM able to adjust fueling for a lean section so I started by taking AFV at 105% and adding the 5% to all of the fuel map front and rear outside of those 4 idle cells I dialed in above, I then added 2% on top of those cells just to start overly rich with the goal to only edit the maps to pull fuel OUT running analysis software. In megalog I edited the AFR table it uses to make new maps a bit as well. That is as far as I got... never messed with timing or enrichment tables. I can cruise at any RPM without issue. My thought is if I hit the desired AFR for each cell under steady state input (no enrichment) I could then back off those enrichment tables later.
    I would suggest if you go back to NB closed loop enabled you take out the 3 second delay to 0 for AFV changes, I used old ECMSpy for this.


    Hope this helps!



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