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Thread: One more time on ECM

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    The number in each cell refers to milliseconds (mS).
    One slight correction, those numbers are injector pulse widths. Each point equals to 58 microseconds. Say table calls for 56 points then injector will be open for 3248 microseconds or 3.248 milliseconds.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    ^^^ Yes. Pulse width, the [U]time[U] the injector is open. I'm just trying to keep it as simple as possible with the learning curve and language barrier

    Datalogging with a wideband O2 is vastly faster and more accurate. WELL worth the small expense.
    You can add a bung in the head pipe to datalog the front separately if you want. Twice the trouble for 2% accuracy (Based on the front fuel table usually being set 2% different).
    Yes, DDFI-3 has at least one extra pin for analog input.
    You can datalog and tune with a NB. It will take much longer, but IMO it will end up being accurate enough for smooth running and long as you allow the ECM to make EGO and AFV corrections afterwards (not locking it out).

    IMO,YMMV,IIRC,LOL

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    ^^^ Yes. Pulse width, the [U]time[U] the injector is open. I'm just trying to keep it as simple as possible with the learning curve and language barrier

    Datalogging with a wideband O2 is vastly faster and more accurate. WELL worth the small expense.
    You can add a bung in the head pipe to datalog the front separately if you want. Twice the trouble for 2% accuracy (Based on the front fuel table usually being set 2% different).
    Yes, DDFI-3 has at least one extra pin for analog input.
    You can datalog and tune with a NB. It will take much longer, but IMO it will end up being accurate enough for smooth running and long as you allow the ECM to make EGO and AFV corrections afterwards (not locking it out).

    IMO,YMMV,IIRC,LOL

    If I understood osvaldo correctly, he would like to data log with all the original settings and sensors in place/functional, plus add wide band too.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Ya he can do that using a single WB O2 in the stock rear location.

    The WB O2 can be used for datalogging (CL off) and with it's NB emulator, can be used for normal CL operation as well.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by cossack84 View Post
    Osvaldo welcome to the forum. I love Italy, very beautiful place. Excellent food, wine and very warm people.
    You welcome!

    First question. Computer extrapolates data in between the cells. Just depends on exact rpm and load. ECM is used to calculate through math equation interpolated value.
    Ok, it is as I was feeling. I don't know how closed to each other are TP () and RMP values used in every calculation but they must be much closer than what we can see on the maps.

    not 100% sure exactly how narrow band is used to measure the O2, but it does pretty good job of keeping air fuel ration where needed. I can watch wide band in real time as narrow band makes corrections, it’s pretty accurate. I don’t think it’s the reason for hit and miss mode.
    ASAP I will try to log and see myself what's going on my engine. According to what I read narrowbands, are working moving ECM to constantly supply the engine with alternatively leaner and reacher mixture as its signal is too easily running away abruptly from 0.45 V (14.7 AFR).
    I am wondering if the up and down AFR is not the cause of the slightly fluctuating idle and the differences between engine pushes, almost cycle by cycle, when in closed loop. But, it is also true that narrowband is used almost everywhere and usually you can't feel any misfire or so...

    Thanks a lot

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Outlaw View Post
    Welcome Osvaldo, no cats or small headers here in the USA just pure Buell fun.
    Lucky guys, i did not know that.
    Thanks for welcome me.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by cossack84 View Post
    One slight correction, those numbers are injector pulse widths. Each point equals to 58 microseconds. Say table calls for 56 points then injector will be open for 3248 microseconds or 3.248 milliseconds.
    ^^^ Yes. Pulse width, the [U]time[U] the injector is open. I'm just trying to keep it as simple as possible with the learning curve and language barrier
    Yes, I was aware of that (from ECMspy guide). This is for DDFI and DDFI II, but I think it should be true even for DDFI III.

    Thanks to both

  8. #18
    If I understood osvaldo correctly, he would like to data log with all the original settings and sensors in place/functional, plus add wide band too.
    Hi cossack84, Yes, you perfectly understood my point!
    I saw that set up on a really nice job from Twin Motorcycle https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/artik...p?cid=7&aid=67
    Unlikely it seems images have gone lost.
    You can see something similar on https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/artik...?cid=7&aid=135
    But this was a Dyno set up and I have no idea which expensive software has been used.
    As you catch I am wondering if it is possible to send trough ECM, BuellTooth, up to ECMdroid additional signal(s) from additional wideband sensor(s)


    Ya he can do that using a single WB O2 in the stock rear location.
    The WB O2 can be used for datalogging (CL off) and with it's NB emulator, can be used for normal CL operation as well.
    It is not fully clear to me. Did you mean, running during CL with NB emulator signal (so you should not be able to data log any true AFR) and log the WB signal only during Open loop?
    If so I think you should also keep always this set up because, at least in some guys opinion, it seems that if you fit back OEM sensor this can read in a different way than the emulator, so giving you troubles if you changed your maps. What do you think about?

    Question aside: on EFI, in general, can't be a WB sensor used for a fully closed loop operation? For sure I am wrong but to me is looking so nice a system based on target AFRs, according to Load, rpm, acceleration, deceleration, and so on, with a constant feedback (and related EGO correction) from a WB sensor. Where am I wrong?

  9. #19
    Yes, DDFI-3 has at least one extra pin for analog input.
    Hi Cooter,

    can you give any idea on which one is and how to use it?

  10. #20
    Senior Member d_adams's Avatar
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    DDFI-3 can log the data via pins 1 and 33 on the gray connector. You'll have to add the wires to the harness by taking the connector apart and adding them in by hand. It's a bit of a pain to do, I've done it a couple of times.
    That said, the ecm is limited and CANNOT (at this time and I doubt it ever will) use the wideband outputs to auto-adjust the ecm or run off of them. It (the ecm) will only use the narrowband signal.



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