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Thread: XB9 - Rotated Engine Now Doesn't Idle/Run??

  1. #21
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brandn3w View Post
    I don't take offense to that at all and you're right. I tried to leave what was fine alone. I guess I didn't realize they were so prone to failure and a maintenance item more than a "only replace when needed" as I thought. Plus my James Gasket kit didn't come with them and I thought they would so that's my mistake.

    Not there yet - I'll try again today and verify it's it for sure.
    Its not that they're prone to failure, but their "tucked away" location in the frame is a pain to reach without at least rotating the motor. You can do it with the motor in place, but its a huge PITA.

    I've found that with the motor in place, if you use the James blue gaskets with the "lower flange" it is really hard to get everything to line up. You may be better off using stock gaskets. With the motor out, you have more room to work and get the manifold lined up in place. If you are going to do it with the motor in place, and insist on the James Blue gaskets, also pick up a set of HD stockers (make sure you can return them if you dont need them). Also, if you dont have them already, pick up a set of stubby (or curvy) wrenches and one of the curvy HD intake manifold allen wrenches. I wound up also cutting down a old cheap wrench and allen key to get in the confines of there.

    Since you have the means to and the know how, and hopefully the bike isnt all the way back together, you may want to consider re-rotating the motor.

    Good luck, take pics and if Cooter offers to come over to drink beer and help, don't do it. He will just drink all your beer and leave. He is a jerk.
    Last edited by 34nineteen; 11-04-2020 at 02:15 PM.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    The Jerk has a WIN on post #2

    Screen Shot 2020-11-04 at 3.10.48 PM.png


    and post #16....

  3. #23
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    Got actual brake cleaner today and just sprayed it all around. It made it stop surging then on the header side I sprayed heavily on that front cylinder and it died again.

    Some smoke from the intake once it was off and I opened the throttle plate and it smelt like brake cleaner as well so that's pretty good indicator it sucked it up.

    I have a small 1/2" wrench and I saw taking out the coil and mounting plate makes a difference in space. Also saw someone use a 1/4" deep well socket and extension to get leverage to loosen the allen head bolts.

    Going to try that first and if it starts to be a royal pain I'll just rotate the engine. Should not be as long second time down and gives assurance I can adequately torque everything.

    Was probably just getting OEM seals honestly after seeing the issues fitting the blue ones. Thanks for the tips!!

    Cooter was right (twice!!) or until I replace them he was right!! 🤪 Praying that's all it is and I'll close it out regardless so others know in the future as well.

    Thank you both and all who contributed!! Very small, niche forum but really great support and information. Thank you truly for the time and attention.

  4. #24
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brandn3w View Post
    Cooter was right (twice!!)

    Hey! We dont talk about stuff like that around here.



    Anyhow, the manifold flange bolts shouldnt be on that tight, as the torque spec is pretty low. The trick is just getting a tool in there and trying to rotate the bolts one "flat" at a time. Removing the coil and bracket will help. Make sure to put an large "X" on the coil so you dont mix things up.

    Its not that its difficult, its just slow, tedious work. Its an easy peasy 15 minute job on a Sportster, but you'll be on this job for a couple of hours. I actually found dug out my old sleeping bag and camping pillow to support myself while reaching in from below. The injector side is the trickier one of the two.

    By the time you are done, you will be kicking yourself for not doing it when the motor was rotated. Oh well, live and learn. Its all good!

  5. #25
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    The Jerk has a WIN on post #2

    Screen Shot 2020-11-04 at 3.10.48 PM.png


    and post #16....


  6. #26
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    At least somebody won today !

  7. #27
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    Not 100% yet...

    Got HD Intake Seals in after rotating engine tonight and old ones still looked really good. Soft and pliable without signs of leaking on the surface.

    Back together and started good and idled better but still surging. After warming up a few minutes I could even slowly rev up last 3K and it come back and surge idle again. Progress!

    Left it idle and it shut off with intake backfire the couldn't restart.

    Here's couple things:

    - Taking off fuel line doesn't spray fuel, isn't it supposed to be under pressure?
    - Removed TB and gas poured out, but since I was underneath IDK if it was the TB fuel line or out of the actual TB itself but it seemed like a lot - stuck fuel injector???
    - Pulled rear PVC and felt the the rocker arm annnnnd it's still loose on the valve - Is this some how my issue???

    Little defeated, but it was $6.46 for seals and took only a few hours to do. Hoping and praying it magically starts and I can ride it tomorrow. Any new thoughts?

  8. #28
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    The fuel line is supposed to be under pressure.

    You felt the rocker through the pcv valve hole? If it is loose, it means you have a stuck valve or a bent pushrod(s). Or both. If you didn’t wait for the lifters to bleed down before rotating the crank, that could be the case. If it’s a stuck valve, a piston probably already bent it for you. It could also be a failed lifter. All of these are going to involve pulling the motor (again) and resolving before addressing the fuel pump.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    Sounds like you have a combination of problems
    1) Maybe a little pressure... right after shut down.
    2) The TB should only have fuel vapor in it. The line will obviously have a 1/2oz or so. You can check for a stuck injector by having the air filter off, cycling the key several times (run switch on) ops the throttle blade and you should not have raw fuel in the TB base.
    3) At TDC and after the lifters bleed down... maybe? A bend pushrod should be easy to see by taking off the rocker cover and spinning it. Doubt it would cause an idle surge though.

    You are all over the place with guesses, this could take awhile. IMO pick a system (like the fuel system) and check it from one end to the other, in order.

  10. #30
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    The lifters don’t get that loose when they bleed down. At most you may be able to rotate a pushrod but even that requires 2 fingers and a bit of effort. I’m going to guess this is a misdiagnosis, or at least I sure as hell hope so.

    If not, welcome to my Buell junkyard of shattered dreams.


    Last edited by 34nineteen; 11-07-2020 at 08:21 PM.

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