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Thread: More clutch lever pull needed for higher gears?

  1. #11
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    [QUOTE=Barrett;626794]the "regularly scheduled thread path" has taken us to this: none of my Buells or any of my three XR1200's have one of these nonsensical QS devices installed. why? because my superior riding skills in conjunction with lightning fast and velvety smooth shifting abilities, preclude the need for any such nanny-assist device. Supremely superior riders perform their own shifts.

    Let the bashing commence.


    OK, I will bite after that bashing. How fast can you shift? With QS it is done in less than 1/10 of a second. On a race track that equates to a fraction of a second for each shift. Each lap equates to multiple seconds. In a race that equates to eternity. Plus, it doesn't upset the suspension like letting off the gas, pulling in the clutch, performing shift, letting out clutch, getting on the gas does. Without it you're just slow. On the street it's just plain fun. Especially when you're taking off from a green light next to somebody who thinks it's nonsensical.

  2. #12
    Senior Member BuellyBagger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barrett View Post
    the "regularly scheduled thread path" has taken us to this: none of my Buells or any of my three XR1200's have one of these nonsensical QS devices installed. why? because my superior riding skills in conjunction with lightning fast and velvety smooth shifting abilities, preclude the need for any such nanny-assist device. Supremely superior riders perform their own shifts.

    Let the bashing commence.

    Attachment 14951
    Attachment 14952
    Attachment 14953
    I dont remember anything in the Geratol commercials about lightning quick shifting? Is there another supplement you're taking to keep up your reflexes John?

  3. #13
    Senior Member BuellyBagger's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=upaero;626796]
    Quote Originally Posted by Barrett View Post
    the "regularly scheduled thread path" has taken us to this: none of my Buells or any of my three XR1200's have one of these nonsensical QS devices installed. why? because my superior riding skills in conjunction with lightning fast and velvety smooth shifting abilities, preclude the need for any such nanny-assist device. Supremely superior riders perform their own shifts.

    Let the bashing commence.


    OK, I will bite after that bashing. How fast can you shift? With QS it is done in less than 1/10 of a second. On a race track that equates to a fraction of a second for each shift. Each lap equates to multiple seconds. In a race that equates to eternity. Plus, it doesn't upset the suspension like letting off the gas, pulling in the clutch, performing shift, letting out clutch, getting on the gas does. Without it you're just slow. On the street it's just plain fun. Especially when you're taking off from a green light next to somebody who thinks it's nonsensical.
    Still dont understand how a QS shift wont damage a transmission, but "proper" clutch free upshifts will. They're doing basically the same thing as far as the transmission is concerned

  4. #14
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    I think you guys are talking very minute differences. The only part of a motorcycle constant mesh trans that would get any wear would be the dogs on the side of the gear. Everything else is in "Constant Mesh". The dogs are the pegs on the side of the gear that lock into the holes of the mating gear to hold it in whatever gear you're in. They need to slide out of those holes as another set slides into the next gear.

    The Barrett way: is to pull the clutch lever slightly as he superiorly upshifts to reduce pressure on the mated dogs in the trans so they can release from one gear and mate with the next one.

    The BuellyBagger proper clutchless upshift way is to: release some throttle pressure at the very moment he upshifts to slow the rate of engine acceleration. That reduces pressure on the mated dogs in the transmission.

    ....which is the same exact thing that a nonsensical quickshifter (TM) does when it kills the ignition (or fuel) for about 80 milliseconds when you touch the shifter to upshift. The engine slows its rate of acceleration and releases some pressure on the mated dogs of the trans.

    All three of those methods should result in smooth upshifting without any damage to the dog faces on the sides of the transmission gears. The only difference is the quickshifter can be operated by any hairless monkey without skill or effort (The Cooter way). Theres a reason almost every performance bike for the last half a decade has a nonsensical quickshifter as OEM.

    The only outlier here is improper shifting. WOT clutchless upshifts (not releasing a little throttle pressure) , and downshifting without blipping the throttle will cause the dogs to slam into the next spinning gear and sometimes not even fully engage, causing wear on the sharp edges that hold the gears together. Round those off enough (usually 2nd gear) and it can pop out under acceleration sounding just like a grinding gear teeth, but it is the dogs skipping over the mating holes, unable to lock the two gears together.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Endopotential's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barrett View Post
    David: i would NOT continue to ride it until the exact cause is identified and repaired. in all probability, your simple "barrel adjustment" is a temporary cure with a predictable short life-span. steps to identify what might have caused this situation:
    good luck.
    Attachment 14950
    John, thanks as always for your thorough and erudite explanations. So teach me some more -

    Point 4 " result of either poor clutch pack/cable adjustment procedures thru the years...or sitting in gear, engine idling, clutch disengaged...for excess periods of time. " I thought motorcycle clutches were designed to do fine being disengaged for long periods, as at a red light. So splitting hairs, it's not really the clutch pack that's damaged but cable housing that gets squashed from being pulled on excessively?
    And I could see it putting pressure on the ramp lip for too much time?

    Point C "C-adjustment release bearing. not sure why this wasn't mentioned." How does one go about inspecting that? Doesn't look like it would come out easily. Can I just turn the back wheel and make sure that release bearing rolls smoothly?

    Thanks gang for all your super useful input.
    Have many of you done the ramp lip kit as just preventative maintenance even if it's not broken (yet)?

    For now I'll take smooth shifting any way I can get, with or without a quickshifter. It'll take me another decade before I can aspire to Barrett's kungfu master skills.
    Last edited by Endopotential; 02-05-2021 at 07:39 PM.

  6. #16
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barrett View Post
    5-Josh correct as usual regarding Dave Flack repair kit. Dave is the go-to guru for this, short of buying a new primary cover.
    I can guarantee you its likely this, as much as it is likely that Cooter drank all the beer.

    8972_20120330080212_L.jpg


    https://www.facebook.com/DMFMachinin...&__tn__=kK-y-R
    Last edited by 34nineteen; 02-05-2021 at 08:43 PM.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    I don't know anyone who would put that much money and time into a primary cover for only preventative measures for such a rare occurrence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    I would DEFINITELY pull the primary and check the clutch ramp for damage before it leaves you stranded.
    What would I win 1.7894 beers?

  8. #18
    Senior Member 34nineteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    I don't know anyone who would put that much money and time into a primary cover for only preventative measures for such a rare occurrence.
    You should be able to pull the primary cover clutch access cover to see if that lip has been compromised or not. Pricing on the kit isnt half bad if you're handy.

    DIY kit is $95 and if you'd like us to repair it for you that will cost $160.



    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    What would I win 1.7894 beers?
    Does it matter?

    Last edited by 34nineteen; 02-05-2021 at 11:01 PM.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Endopotential's Avatar
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    The instructions aren't explicitly posted (reasonable, as I'm sure he put a fair bit of R&D into the project).

    But I'm guessing it involves grinding off the lip, flush with the webbing of the cover, with maybe some sort of die grinder and then levelling smooth with a sander? And drill and tap those mounting holes.

    I've got that stuff in the garage. I'm up for another DIY project, but really hope I won't have to.

  10. #20
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    It's very simple with clear instructions. A dial caliper helps with making it perfect.



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