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Thread: ignition control module vs ignition sensor? 07 xb12r

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    Member evilokc's Avatar
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    ignition control module vs ignition sensor? 07 xb12r

    im troubleshooting an intermittent no spark issue. I'm using a pdf ( bullmods.com) of the manual and it says it could be a bad ignition module or a bad ignition sensor. it doesn't show me the location of these parts. when i search ignition module and ignition sensor it shows me what looks like the cps. the manual speaks as if these are two separate parts. i will continue searching but if anyone can give me the location of these parts i would appreciate the help. as of now im "assuming" the manual is calling the cam position sensor an ignition sensor. so that answers half the question.
    Last edited by evilokc; 05-22-2022 at 01:43 AM.

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    Senior Member Barrett's Avatar
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    Ignition module and ignition sensor as per 03-07 Service Manuals, are in fact the same component. The folks at Harley-Davidson Publications/Documents division published all the XB-XL-XR manuals, so they tend to intertwine nomenclature. It is the component located behind the cover plate on the nose end of the cam cover. It simply signals the ECM as to what position the crankshaft is in relative to required ignition parameters.

    Intermittent loss-of-spark causes:
    Failing coil---------most common
    Failing CPS--------fairly common
    Failing plug high-tension wires----most common
    Coil feed wiring harness chafed thru---least common
    Failing kill switch---------------least common
    Failing ignition switch----------least common

    CPS-do heat test
    Coil--do OHMS test
    Plug wires---do OHMS test
    All else---do visual

    You're welcome.

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    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    It depends greatly on the circumstances of the loss of ignition, but I've had a rash of corroded right handlebar switches lately. Glad they're still cheap! When it's running wiggle test the red run switch and the key to see if the bike dies.

    Heat related failure is commonly the CPS.

    Loss of ignition on one cylinder is commonly the coil (or circuit).

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    Member evilokc's Avatar
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    thanks for the replies guys. its an annoying issue. with these intermittent problems there is rarely a eureka moment where you know its fixed. you do the repair you believe is the issue then ride it out to see if you get left stranded. im glad you mentioned the heat test for the cps. i was going to ask how i test it. ive never had a starting issue when its hot though. ive had some bad stumbling/missing when im running it to higher rpm but the starting issue has always been completely cold. i will check out the handle bar wires as well. i appreciate having some direction to go.

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    Member evilokc's Avatar
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    i ran out to give it a go. i started the bike and let it run about 30 seconds to see if it was going to play nice.it started perfectly. during that 30 seconds i wiggled the right handlebar wires but there was no change. i shut it down pulled the cover and after touching the cps to make sure it wasn't hot put some heat on it. i read that it should be just hot enough that you cant leave you fingers on it so that's what i did. once i felt the temp was right i hit the starter button and it wouldn't start. it was cranking but didn't even attempt to start. i assume this means the cps is bad? the glue over the wires is very spongy but i don't see any other physical damage.

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    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    So have you tested for spark during the issue?

    Not starting when cold is a common result of fouled plugs. Buells run a very long, very rich, cold start cycle. Starting it cold and running it for 30 seconds instead of warming it up completely will definitely foul plugs and do it very quickly. Causing a no start. Something to watch for.

    Next time it won't start. Check for spark.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooter View Post
    So have you tested for spark during the issue?

    Not starting when cold is a common result of fouled plugs. Buells run a very long, very rich, cold start cycle. Starting it cold and running it for 30 seconds instead of warming it up completely will definitely foul plugs and do it very quickly. Causing a no start. Something to watch for.

    Next time it won't start. Check for spark.
    It will also provide an amazingly loud pop should it start...

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    Member evilokc's Avatar
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    after i did the heat test on the cps it wouldn't start again for two days. today i walked by it and decided to hit the button and it fired immediately. can i do the cps heat test while the bike is running? the spark plugs and wires are new but i will look at them as well. will check for spark next time it happens. I'm almost positive i checked for spark the last time it happened and i wasn't getting any.

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    Senior Member Cooter's Avatar
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    I believe you are chasing a ghost rabbit down it's hole. Back up before you self-diagnosed an "intermittent no spark issue" and please answer this as clearly as you can.

    So:
    1) Does your bike die while riding? and
    1A) Re-start immediately? (Ignition circuit, coil),
    1B) Re-start only after cooling off. (CPS)

    Or
    2) Runs fine doesn't die but sometimes it will start and sometimes it won't.
    2A) At any time hot or cold, like during a gas stop.
    2B) When it's in the garage and has been sitting, cold.

    If 2B sounds familiar... replace your plugs (Ya, I know, again) or clean them very well with solvent and compressed air. If you're too lazy for that, alternatively the next time it starts, do NOT turn it off, go get your damn helmet and ride that poor thing like a normal human for at least 25 MILES. Not 24 miles. Not Ricky McWheelie Racer BS, just go ride it.

    Park it and don't ever start your Buell again unless you are holding your helmet and are going for at least a 10 mile ride.
    Last edited by Cooter; 05-26-2022 at 11:30 PM.

  10. #10
    Member evilokc's Avatar
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    the bike has only ever died while riding once at a very long light. it was very hesitant to start back. i really didn't think it was going to start. it has only ever not started after sitting for a multiple hours . i will pull the plugs and see how they look and update you. i appreciate the help.



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